Interview with Alan Jones, 2GB

1 May 2020

ALAN JONES: Prime Minister, good morning.

PRIME MINISTER: Good morning, Alan.

JONES: Thank you for your time. Thank you for what you've been doing in the very, very onerous task. Look, I had, as I indicated to you, what we might be talking about. But let's ask you a couple of off field questions. The New South Wales Primary Principals Association President, Phil Seymour, has pleaded with New South Wales parents to keep their children at home. We need parents to hold the line by sending lots of kids in. You're going to send the whole system into chaos. And of the Prime Minister, he said the Prime Minister should butt out. Do you have a comment about that?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, we've done this all the way through, Alan, and by following the medical advice and the advice from educationalists and the medical advice is very clear. Children are safe at school and the research done by Curtin University, Victoria University and a whole range of universities, University of Tasmania, have all demonstrated quite categorically that the educational needs of children are not served by having at home learning. They're best served by having children in the classroom at school.

JONES: That is 100 per cent correct. That is 100 per cent. But what I’m saying to you is…

PRIME MINISTER: We'll just follow the expert advice.

JONES: That's 100 per cent correct. It’s the educational advice too.

PRIME MINISTER: The policy should be based on the expert advice. 

JONES: Yeah, but Annastacia Palaszczuk, Gladys Berejiklian, Daniel Andrews are virtually saying to you what this bloke is saying, butt out.

PRIME MINISTER: No, I don't know if that's what they say. I mean, I expect to see in a lot of these jurisdictions the move towards and particularly here in New South Wales, I mean, the Premier here in New South Wales, has already indicated that path, and I welcome that. And look, all states and territories are going to move at different paces. And in the National Cabinet, we meet again today. We respect each other. They have jurisdiction over state schools in their states and they will make decisions about that. But let's not be unclear about what the expert medical advice is, which is that children are safe at school. What I've said consistently is that the issue relates to teachers and their risk is in the staff room, not the classroom, and at pick up and drop off and there has to be appropriate procedures in place. I've said that consistently all along.

JONES: I know. I know you have. But my concern now, as you're the Prime Minister of Australia, is the educational wellbeing of these kids. Now, I've spoken to educational experts on this program. The first aspect of this face to face classroom teaching is that education is relational and learning is facilitated by positive and strong relationships, ideally built on face to face contact. Now, kids preparing for the HSC are being denied that. You can't be educated on one day a week. You can't be educated. In the ACT, they're not even allowed to come to school.

PRIME MINISTER: Well, I'm pleased about what's happening in WA and Northern Territory, South Australia. They'll be up well over 60, well, Northern Territory about 100 per cent.

JONES: But what do you say to the mums and dads who are worried about their kids' future via the HSC? They’re saying my child's not being taught, this is going to jeopardise his future.

PRIME MINISTER: Well, these are the points that I've been making. And I'm pleased that in a fortnight's time, year 11 and 12 students at the school that my kids go to, they'll be back full time and years K-6 will be back full time and seven, eight, nine, ten will be back in face to face.

JONES: You must be putting your children at risk, mustn't you?

PRIME MINISTER: Not at all. Not at all.

JONES: This is terrible stuff.

PRIME MINISTER: I think we’ll get there, Alan, I think we'll get there. And, you know, we're a Federation and we've been working constructively within the Federation and the National Cabinet. But the one thing that is not in dispute is that the medical advice is that children are safe and the educationalist’s advice from the research, the evidence is their learning outcomes will not be as good at home.

JONES: PM, the one thing you've got is the purse strings. Now, you are giving states money to educate our children five days a week. Now, they're only going to educate them one day a week, why don't they only get one fifth of the money?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, I don't think we're in that territory. I mean, as you know, with Independent and Catholic schools, we fund them 80 per cent. The state governments do 20. And for state schools, it's round the other way. And when it comes to Independent and Catholic schools, we've made it very clear we expect you to be at least 50 per cent attendance within the month and to have a plan to get all your kids back into school. And you do that, we’ll be able to provide some financial incentives by bringing forward your payments. So we're using that leverage unapologetically because we know what the medical advice is. We know what's good for the kids. We know what's good for their education. We know it's good for the economy. And we don't make any apologies for that.

JONES: Good on you. Andrew Forrest, now, I've been friends with Andrew Forrest most probably longer than you have. Forget the fact that he blindsided Greg Hunt, and he did. He's arguing that the Minister had given approval and my understanding, certain understanding, is that didn't happen. However, you have called all sorts worldwide. You've talked to Trump and Macron and other people about having a worldwide inquiry into the source of this coronavirus, which has devastated the Western world and the economies. At that press conference on Wednesday, Andrew Forrest described China as, quote, “The country which suffered the virus first. It's a moot point where it came from. I don't know if this virus started in China or somewhere else. And I don't care because it just might be Australia. It might be Britain, it might be China.” Can you understand the indignation of Australian people over these comments?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, look, I appreciate what Andrew has done as well in working on this issue with us. I mean, we've got access to testing kits which have all been tested in Australia to make sure they're up to the mark and they are and we appreciate that and we appreciate what he did with us working to get access to those. And the Minderoo Foundation will be fully reimbursed, as was the transaction to enable that to happen. So we appreciate that. And, you know, the great work that he does obviously with indigenous communities and more broadly, so that that is all acknowledged.

JONES: But you’re the Prime Minister, why could you not have picked up the phone and spoken to this BGI mob?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, Alan, I'm not going to go into how we get things done. The point is we get things done. And we work with a lot of partners and we get things done to protect Australians and to make sure we have what we need to ensure Australia is as safe as it can be and we've worked with Andrew to that end, and we thank him for that. But when it comes to foreign affairs advice, I'll take my foreign affairs advice from foreign affairs officials. When it comes to business advice, I'll talk to business people. When it comes to health advice, I'll talk to health people. I won’t ask them for history advice either. That's what I'll do. I'll talk to the experts in their field.

JONES: Well, one other thing here. The stuff has been acquired from Beijing Genomics Institute. And the president is a chap by the name, was called Chairman Wang and Andrew Forrest praised Chairman Wang a number of times on Wednesday, describing their friendship as running very deep. This is the same Chairman Wang in 2018 who told his staff at China's BGI they’re forbidden to have children with birth defects. His words exactly. If they were born with defects, it would be a disgrace to all our 7,000 staff.

PRIME MINISTER: Well, the Consul was not invited by the Commonwealth to that press conference. Let's be clear about that. And look, and when it comes to the origin of this virus, which has taken the lives of over 200,000 people around the world at least, and it’s probably many more times that. I mean, I don't think anybody's in any fantasy land about where it started. It started in China and what the world over needs to know - and there's a lot of support for this - is how did it start and what are the lessons that can be learned? That needs to be done independently. I mean, and why do we want to know that? Because it could happen again. It could happen in South America….

JONES: All I'm saying is you've got Andrew Forrest saying it could have happened in Australia, could’ve started here.

PRIME MINISTER: Well, that's obviously not true. That's obviously nonsense. It happened, it started in China, and that is not a statement of accusation or criticism. It's just a statement of fact. And we need to understand how that happened.

JONES: I agree with you, everyone agrees with you. That's why you’ve got the highest ratings of any Prime Minister in history, and that's why everyone agrees with you. But I’m saying that you've got these people, in my view, white anting you. What about, sorry, we've got to talk about these things, this Dr Annaliese van Diemen, who's taken to Twitter on Wednesday to mark the  250th anniversary of Captain Cook's landing. And she says - she's from the People's Republic of Victoria - she says, “Sudden arrival of an invader from another land, decimating populations, creating terror, forces the population to make enormous sacrifices and completely changes how they live in order to survive. COVID-19 or Cook 1770.”

PRIME MINISTER: Yeah, look, I found that those sort of comments very disappointing. She clearly won't get the job as chief historian, but when it comes to medical advice, I mean, I applaud the work she's doing as a medical officer in Victoria. That's her expertise. I would strongly suggest she keep to that because those sorts of comments don't inspire confidence and people should stick to their day jobs. That's what I really try to say. I mean, a lot of people expressing a lot of opinions about stuff that they're not expert on. And I'm going to listen to the experts in their field rather than their broader opinions on any- we've all got opinions on lots of things and they're terribly interesting. But the ones that matter are the ones where people have that expert background and experience that we can rely on. And in this case, I mean, of course, I'm the member for Cook, for goodness sake, April 29, 250 years, Cook was an amazing navigational scientist. He played such a critical role in the age of enlightenment. And his role in our country's history is incredible. At the same time, we acknowledge the indigenous Australians, the Gweagal people, the Dharawal nation there, and there are some amazing new installations we’ve put out there in Kurnell when COVID is passed and when we're able to move around a bit more I’d encourage people go out there and have a look. It really tells a great story. That meeting of two cultures and we commemorated that this week, we acknowledged it. Both Cook’s place in our history, which is incredibly important. We shouldn't be ashamed of our history. But we should tell it openly and honestly and learn from it.

JONES: Good on you. Just on the experts, everyone is pushing for a vaccine because we can't stop any virus infecting people. There are two ways of immunizing the population. One is to allow people in a regulated way, as Sweden is doing, in a controlled way to get the virus and given that there's a certain demographic cohort. They say those under 65. You said that in your original state. You said, well, many will just have symptoms no worse than the common flu. If they contracted the virus, we would build an immunity. Short of a vaccine. And that's called his herd immunity. Is there a concern from the experts that are advising you that having people locked up and then we open up, which everyone wants you to do, open up the economy, when we then enter society again, the population basically won't have any immunity?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, no one's going to hit herd immunity. Sweden is not going to hit herd immunity. I mean, Sweden has a death rate, 70 times Australia's at the moment, 70 times. So, and even the countries that have been most devastated, they're nowhere near herd immunity. And so the idea that a country can hit herd immunity without wiping out hundreds of thousands of people is just not based on evidence.

JONES: No, well, I’m only raising it because people don't have the immunity and they move out, is there a risk, therefore, of perhaps you have to start again with all of this if there's a quote unquote second wave?

PRIME MINISTER: This is a key point. This is a very important point. And this is why, yes, look there is the curve that we had to flatten on health. But the curve I want to flatten is on unemployment as well. The curve I want to flatten is business closures, the curve I want to flatten, is the rising number of people are on income support, whether it's on JobKeeper or JobSeeker. We've got to flatten all of these curves, not just one of them. Success is not just turning up each day and saying we have no cases or a few. If there's no jobs and there's no businesses and no income, well, that's not success. And we've got to deal with both of these challenges. But when we do it and I agree with Gladys, we've got to do it in a way that it's not stop and start where you sort of open a whole bunch of things and then you’ve got to close them all again. So you've got to just move constantly through each step. And that's what we're seeking to do. That's what National Cabinet's talking about today. We want to keep taking steps to get our economy up and running again as much as it can be in a COVID safe environment. And speaking of COVID safe, the most important thing anyone can do to help us get this economy open again is download the COVIDSafe app, we’re at about 3 and a half million, that's still not enough. And we will be sitting around the National Cabinet table looking at those numbers on the COVIDSafe application download. And if we're not getting, we've got we had a really good success this week, but we've got to keep that up. If people want to get back to normal, then you've got to download the COVIDSafe app.

JONES: I bet you didn't download the app, but someone did it for you. I have to confess, I downloaded it,

PRIME MINISTER: I did too! I helped my mum with it.

JONES: Did you do it yourself? I didn’t, I’ve downloaded it, but someone had to show me how to do it.

PRIME MINISTER: The kids have done it, Jen’s done it, we’ve all done it.

JONES: Did you do it yourself or did the kids show you how to do it? Come on, fess up!

PRIME MINISTER: I promise it was me, hand on heart.

JONES: All right. Good to talk to you. Keep going. Yes. What you say, that the whole purpose of the app, of course, is to be able to identify if someone's been in contact with someone who has tested positive.

PRIME MINISTER: Yeah, and it’s like a slip slop and slap on the app, Alan. That's just what we’ve got to do it because it's like going out in the sun. You've got to put your sunscreen on. And when we go back out into the economy, we need that protection because that tells us who's been in contact. And we can track people down quickly, isolate them so they don't spread it to more, when that's happening. We can open up our economy more.

JONES: Great to hear you talking about flattening the other curves. That really gives people a lot of hope. Good to talk to you. Talk to you next week. Thank you for your time.

PRIME MINISTER: Thanks, Alan.

JONES: Righto there he is the Prime Minister, Scott Morrison.

https://pmtranscripts.pmc.gov.au/release/transcript-42803

Australia Marks 250th Anniversary of Endeavour’s Historic Voyage

29 April 2020

Prime Minister, Minister for Communications Cyber Safety and the Arts, Minister for Indigenous Australians

Today marks 250 years since Captain James Cook and HMB Endeavour voyaged to the east coast of Australia in 1770.

This historic anniversary provides all Australians with an opportunity to reflect on our shared history, celebrate the legacy of the world’s oldest continuing living culture, and understand the origins of modern Australia.

Prime Minister Scott Morrison said the anniversary represented a merging of histories.

“The day Cook and the local Indigenous community at Kamay first made contact 250 years ago changed the course of our land forever,” the Prime Minister said.

“It’s a point in time from which we embarked on a shared journey which is realised in the way we live today.

“We honour the resilience, wisdom, custodianship and stewardship of Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Australians. Indigenous culture is a fundamental element of modern Australia.

“We also acknowledge the extraordinary individual of James Cook whose passion for science and discovery played such a critical role in Australia’s journey to the nation we are today.”

Minister for Indigenous Australians, Ken Wyatt said the Endeavour’s arrival in Australia is a very important chapter in our history which dates back 65,000 years.

“The anniversary represents an opportunity to reflect upon the impact and changes felt by Indigenous Australians, and also to gain a better understanding of how Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islanders lived prior to European settlement. The Endeavour’s arrival marked the first true understanding from the Western World on the world’s longest living Indigenous culture, and revealed the different ways in which science was used to help guide exploration and discovery,” Minister Wyatt said.

Minister for Communications, Cyber Safety and the Arts, Paul Fletcher said while the COVID-19 pandemic is currently front of mind for Australians, it remains important to mark key dates in our history that have helped shaped our nation and national identity.

“This year it is particularly important that we are reminded of the sense of community that exists among us all, even when we cannot physically gather together,” Minister Fletcher said.

“It is through reflecting on our history that we can better understand who we are as Australians and help future generations to understand these events.

“The Endeavour voyage expanded the West’s knowledge of the world: the east coast of Australia was charted and native plants and animals were studied and collected.

“Western and Indigenous cultures are connected through their approaches to the natural world around them, highlighting how central ‘knowledge’ is to both cultures.

“Some exhibitions and activities for the anniversary have been suspended or delayed due to the current COVID-19 situation. Our national cultural institutions are working hard to take the educational experiences and exhibitions they have developed to new audiences online – supporting children and teachers as they navigate their new learning environments.

“Other initiatives, including the Australian Institute of Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Studies project to return Indigenous cultural heritage and upgrades to the Kamay Botany Bay National Park visitor facilities will have lasting value for the community when they are completed.”

The Government has released a new website - www.endeavour250.gov.au - to mark the anniversary, which includes information from a range of perspectives and educational resources for teachers and students.

Decisions about future Endeavour 250 activities will be informed by official health advice on the community response to COVID-19.

https://pmtranscripts.pmc.gov.au/release/transcript-42801

Interview with Macca, Australia All Over

26 April 2020

MACCA: Good morning, Prime Minister Scott Morrison. 

PRIME MINISTER: G’day, Macca, how are you mate?

MACCA: Mate, I’m alright. Had a busy morning here, it’s always. It's been a different time for us in COVID because everybody seems to be home and they're all ringing. We just have our work cut out, just answering the calls. Prime Minister, you had a busy day yesterday, but not busy in the normal way. I saw your speech, I read your speech. It was very good and a speech for the times, really, wasn't it?

PRIME MINISTER: Oh, well, thank you. But look, it was a great honour and a privilege to be at the War Memorial yesterday. And it was very different. Normally, there'd be 30,000 people there yesterday. But I thought yesterday right across the country and the way people responded and found ways to remember, to honour, to reflect but most importantly, to draw the inspiration that I know everybody needs to draw at the moment. People in rural Australia have been drawing inspiration for a long time. They've been going through hardship with the drought and then after that, the bushfires. But so they know all about that and I think it was a much-needed injection of the Anzac spirit to have us all reflect on that yesterday and I think the way Australians responded was beautiful.

MACCA: So do I. And we've got, you know, although I don't know about playing the bagpipes at 5.30am in the morning in your local street. But that happened that in a few places.

PRIME MINISTER: I had heard that story. 

MACCA: But anyway, my mum played the bagpipes and my father played the trombone and he was always ribbing her, you know, because the bagpipes didn't rate the brass players, brass players are proper musicians. And anyway, it was, look, we should talk about all sorts of things, really. And people are talking about exit strategies and what the new normal be and what will look like. And especially for older people, I've got a sister who's got asthma and so she's on her own, which is good. And we talk over the fence and we, but probably going onwards, they won't be able to really get around in the ways they used to, will they?

PRIME MINISTER: That will be the hardest area. We're definitely on the road back now. We've reopened elective surgery. The schools are coming back in much, much better ways than when they were going into the break and that's great. It won't be long before we'll see, I think, more businesses opened up again and we'll try and get back to some type of normal. But until there's obviously a vaccine, then things like the social distancing and, particularly, everyone being very conscious of their hand hygiene and all of these sorts of things. That will have to become instinctive and for those who are most vulnerable in our community and they're those who have other respiratory type issues, the elderly, those who are like Willie who I was talking about yesterday, who's on chemo and, you know, they will always be in a more sensitive place will have to be very careful for them going forward. That's why all around the world, I mean, one of the most common issues that I discuss with leaders around the world is finding this vaccine. And everybody is, you know, there's never been, I think, more effort going into finding a vaccine than for this virus. And so we're hopeful that that might mean that we'll get a breakthrough earlier than might otherwise be the case.

MACCA: The schools, why aren’t kids back at school? It seems to me just reading all the bits and pieces about it, that the kids maybe should be back in school, I think, and especially for kids who come from homes that aren't as, you know, favourable as yours or mine was. School is the best place, isn’t it?

PRIME MINISTER: That is the medical advice. It's also the advice of educationalists as well in terms of where's the best place for a child to learn. And there needs to be some changes made in the schools to protect teachers. But as I've said many times, their risk is in the staff room, not the classroom. The evidence is pretty clear that the transmission between children amongst very young ages is very, very low. And so like any other workplace, whether it be mine, yours or anywhere else where you're going to work, you've got to observe those distances. I've got a big sign outside my office door about how many people can be in there at any one time and there's a bottle of hand sanitiser in the office and out of it and all that. That's just the stuff you've got to do now. Now, if you do that and you manage to pick up and drops off well and ensure the distancing is done there, I mean, yes, kids need to get back. And that's a big part of the road back, I think, getting schools as much back to normal as we possibly can and it's great to see that's happening in South Australia, Western Australia, it’s already happening up in the Territory. And I have no doubt that in time we'll see that happen in the larger states as well.

MACCA: Speaking about your office and hand sanitisers, I've been thinking about what you do and because I see you every other day and with Mr Murphy, the Chief Medical Officer, and you're doing things. How's your day? I mean, are you sleeping, because you're doing stuff all the time and you're trying to get, you know, all the detail on board. And I mean, I'm glad you’re 50 and not 78 like Mr Biden, who's going to maybe be the President. You know, I mean, I just don't think he's going to cope with it. I mean, you've got to be young and on top of it and you obviously are a lot younger than he and I just... my mind boggles when I think of the things you've got to do and you get up and have breakfast and you got a briefing and then another briefing. And I mean, it must be this whole experience for you, Prime Minister, must have…. I mean, you just look back and I mean, do you get time to sit down and read the paper or just think about what you've been doing for the last month or two?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, you do, and it's important that you do because you’ve got to remain sharp and you try and keep a regime up. You get a bit of exercise, make sure you're seeing the family as I do, they’re with me here in Canberra. And you've got to have those times and I’ll have a bit of that time today as well, which is important. I've actually, in that spare time, I've been reading about good old Joseph Lyons from many years ago and just finished a great book on Joseph Lyons. He was going through very similar times back there in the Depression.

MACCA: And Dame Enid, wasn’t it, his wife?

PRIME MINISTER: These were very different times. There were many things that this time round we were in a much better position to deal with this. Certainly economically we were much stronger. And also the fact that all the states and territories are working together. They give me a great deal of support, of course, in their own roles as leaders in their own states and we've kept together as a Federation, I think, through this better than any other time dealing with a national crisis of this nature. But, you know, look, you keep your pace. It is a busy day. I mean, there are a lot of people out there working busy jobs and whether they be in the health system or in supermarkets or wherever they happen to be. But it is a constant stream of making decisions each and every day. And you've got to put yourself in the best private frame of mind to make the best possible ones, get the best advice. But at the end of the day, you've got to make the calls and you've got to take responsibility for them.

MACCA: And let's hope, I hope certainly, that there's after this we get... what’s the date, basically, when you think we'll start to ease things?  You said sometime in May?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, we already are easing things, I'd stress that first. The National Cabinet just under three weeks from now has set a date to review what we call these baseline restrictions. And that is, you know, when we put in place all those businesses that had to close their doors. That is going to be reviewed formally and a decision taken within the next three weeks. And if it is able to be done sooner than that or if the evidence and on the basis of the medical evidence, then certainly we would do that. But we're already seeing a lot of states and territories who went a bit harder than those baselines now starting to pull that back and considering some changes. We're seeing that in pretty much all the states, particularly now in New South Wales, we're seeing a bit more there. And I look forward to seeing more of that, because the health effect of this is devastating, of course. And we've been very successful in avoiding the horror show that we've seen in other parts of the world and we can't be complacent about that, even still. I mean, the figure that totally just does my head in is the fact that France has a death rate 100 times greater than Australia and in the UK, it's almost 100 times greater. Now, we're talking about serious, developed economies with good health systems. And so, you know, none of us can be complacent about it. So, yeah, look mate, it is a factor of just staying on top of that. But we need to get our economy back. We need to get livelihoods. I've said it the whole time, this is about saving lives and saving livelihoods. JobKeeper and JobSeeker is there, but it's not intended to be there as a permanent measure. It's to help get us through the worst of this. And we all need to work to getting on the other side where that level of support will no longer be necessary because we'll have our economy up and running. And I want to get back to that as soon as we can.

MACCA: You know, I always say, you know, because I'm a musician. And if you ever think you've got nothing to do, go and pick up your instrument and try and play it, because there's always lots of things to do. We had a call this morning from a vet and he was talking about mental health problems of vets. And, you know, and everybody's talked about this time of isolation and things like that and health problems just incredible. That's the other thing of this, isn't it, as well as the economy, it is the mental health because it seems to be.

PRIME MINISTER: Yeah it is and we early on put in a very big package to support, financial package, to support increased mental health support and many of the lessons that we're putting in place here, Macca, we learned through working through the drought and the supports we know are so necessary. And as people in rural areas, in the farming communities are going through such hardship, not just for a few months, but for years and years and years and years. And I know for many that is still the case. The one point, one of the good days I’ve had in the last few months is when I was starting to see some of those… I had the Bureau of Meteorology come in and see me earlier this year and they gave me a much more optimistic outlook than I'd seen for a long time on that front. And so that was very welcome news and the fact that we hopefully will see some winter crops go in. That's fantastic. Michael McCormack and I are so thrilled about that. But that meant we had to make sure we get the workers there to ensure that that work could be done and we need to make sure they get the loans from the banks and various other things so they get those crops in. I think the rural community is going to play a big role with our recovery, a really big role. And David Littleproud and together with Michael McCormick and I, we’re doing a lot of work to see how we can ensure that they realise that. Shane Stone, of course, with the Drought Recovery Agency, they're continuing to do their work and each and every day.

MACCA: Yeah, there's lots of things to talk about. We haven’t got time. But a couple of things. I know the contact app is something that you're pretty keen about. And what's your hope with that?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, it's another tool that we need so we can get back to normal as much as we possibly can. There are three things you can do to help you, well, someone described it the other day as dancing with the virus, because it's still going to be there until there's a vaccine. And you need comprehensive testing, which we have the best testing regimes in the world, and that's been ramped up even further now to about 40,000-50,000 tests a day. That means if there is an outbreak, when you're going back to more normal activity, you can get onto it quickly. And then you've got to be able to lock it down and that's why you need what's called tracing when someone gets the coronavirus. What normally happens, if you would just indulge me for a second, if someone gets the coronavirus, the health agency in the state gets in touch with that person and they say, I need to know who you were in contact with over these periods when you were infectious and that could be prior to them getting symptoms. And that person has got to go back and think about all the people they may have been in contact with. Now, in many cases they might not have even known those people. They just might have been at the supermarket or they might have been out…

MACCA: The coffee shop.

PRIME MINISTER: The shop or wherever. Now, what the contact tracing app does, all it does is, is in that period for which you would have been potentially passing it on to others, it has what's called a Bluetooth handshake. So it doesn't know where you've been, where you might have been visiting or what shops you're at or what towns you're in or anything like that. It doesn't know any of that. All it knows is the other phones that you came in contact with and that information only gets downloaded when someone gets the coronavirus and then that person who has it enables it to be downloaded to that health officer. So what it's doing is it's helping the health officer do their job rather than relying on all of our memories. And the quicker they do their job, then the faster they can get in contact with people who may have been exposed to it, who then have that information, and then they can go straight into isolation, stay away from elderly relatives or others and that's how it saves lives. So it's just about helping these health officers do their job. No other government agency can get in touch, can't use this information. No one in the Commonwealth Government at all. And in state authorities, only the health officer can use it. Not the police, not the welfare people, nowhere else. Just the health officer. It’s a tool for them.

MACCA: Prime Minister, just tell me quickly about a good mate of mine, Frankie Misson, used to play for Australia Cricket. His wife is in care and he can't visit her. That's a bit of a shame, isn't it?

PRIME MINISTER: Is it. I've been disappointed about this and there was a meeting on Friday night. I'll get the report on that when we sit down again on Monday. But what I'm keen to do is ensure that people living in aged care facilities get their visits. Now, that doesn't mean they can have 100 visitors a day. Of course not. That would be dangerous. But there can be two visits a day and particularly by loved ones and close support people and that should be the norm. Now, if there's an outbreak in a centre like we've seen in Newmarch and a few other places then, of course, you’ve got to lock that down and you've got to prevent people coming in because that's a serious health risk. But otherwise, the health advice is it is safe. It is safe for people to have those visits that they've been having. You just can't have a lot of them. And the other part of it is, Macca, is you can't go and lock these people up in their rooms all day. That’s not Ok. You've got to be able to move around in the facility and sit in the common area or sit outside. I'm concerned about their wellbeing, both the physical and the mental wellbeing of people in aged care facilities. They can't be closed off from the public and become secret places. They need to be, have those visits and families need to know how their family members are doing and be able to provide them with that support.

MACCA: Same with the disabled, too. Look, Prime Minister, we've got to go. But nice to talk to you. It's interesting, I think, about the floods and the drought and the bushfires and then the floods and now the COVID. We're all doing it tough, including you. More power to your arm, I hope you do well because you're doing it for us, hopefully.

PRIME MINISTER: Well, thanks, Macca, thanks for having me on, all the best to everyone. Thanks to Australia for all you're doing to keep us all safe, to save lives and to save livelihoods. We appreciate that all and I'm sure we took great inspiration from our diggers yesterday. And thank you for the way you remembered them also.

MACCA: Good on you, Scott. Thank you. Bye. The Prime Minister, Scott Morrison.

https://pmtranscripts.pmc.gov.au/release/transcript-42800

COVIDSafe: New App to Slow the Spread of Coronavirus

26 April 2020

Prime Minister, Minister for Health, Minister for Government Services, Chief Medical Officer

The Australian Government today launches the new voluntary coronavirus app, COVIDSafe.

The app is an important public health initiative that will help keep you, your family, and your community safe from further spread of coronavirus through early notification of possible exposure.

“Australians are doing an extraordinary job to flatten the curve and contain the spread of the coronavirus, but we cannot be complacent,” said Prime Minister Scott Morrison.

“The Chief Medical Officer’s advice is we need the COVIDSafe app as part of the plan to save lives and save livelihoods.  The more people who download this important public health app, the safer they and their family will be, the safer their community will be and the sooner we can safely lift restrictions and get back to business and do the things we love.”

The health initiative uses technology to automate and improve what state and territory health officials already do manually. COVIDSafe will speed up the process of identifying people who have been in close contact with someone diagnosed with coronavirus, quickly stopping further spread of the virus in the community.

Minister for Health, Greg Hunt thanked Australians for their actions during the pandemic, and said the app is part of the three key requirements for easing restrictions: Test, Trace and Respond.

“We thank Australians for their help in adhering to the difficult but life-saving social distancing measures,” Minister Hunt said.

“We are now calling on all Australians to download the COVIDSafe app to help protect you, your family and your community from further spread of COVID-19. This will be necessary if we are to start easing some of the difficult social distancing restrictions we have had to put in place” Minister Hunt said.

“It will be one of the critical tools we will use to help protect the health of the community by quickly alerting people who may be at risk of having contact with COVID-19. If you’d been exposed, you’d want to know, wouldn’t you?”

The app has received strong support from states and territories and the health sector, which recognise it is a valuable tool that will enhance the ability to respond rapidly to local outbreaks, and the confidence to know the virus is not silently spreading throughout communities.

A new determination issued by the Minister for Health under the Biosecurity Act will ensure information provided voluntarily through the App will only be accessible for use by authorised state and territory health officials. Any other access or use will be a criminal offence. 

Minister for Government Services, Stuart Robert described the App as being developed with one purpose: to stop the spread of coronavirus.

“Once installed and running, the COVIDSafe app uses Bluetooth to look for other phones that also have the app installed,” Minister Robert said.

“To be effective, users should have the app running in the background when they are coming into contact with others. Your phone does not need to be unlocked for the app to work.”

“It then securely makes a ‘digital handshake’, which notes the date and time, distance and duration of the contact. All information collected by the app is securely encrypted and stored in the app on the user’s phone. No one, not even the user, can access it.”

“Unless and until a person is diagnosed with COVID-19, no contact information collected in the app is disclosed or able to be accessed. Then, once the person agrees and uploads the data, only the relevant state or territory public health officials will have access to information. The only information they are allowed to access is that of close contacts – when a person has come within approximately 1.5 metres of another app user for 15 minutes or more – in their jurisdiction,” Minister Robert said.

Welcoming the announcement, Australian Chief Medical Officer, Brendan Murphy said COVIDSafe is set to be a major tool in streamlining the process of identifying contacts after a person tests positive for coronavirus.

“Finding out quickly means you can quarantine yourself or be treated much faster, protecting your family and friends from possible infection, and slowing the spread of the virus,” Professor Murphy said.

“Without this technology, health officials have to rely on people being able to remember who they have been around, and being able to provide contact details for those people.”

“It is important to note that only state and territory health officials will be able to use the information.”

“COVIDSafe only keeps contact information for 21 days. This covers the maximum incubation period for the virus and the time it takes for someone to be tested for COVID-19,” Professor Murphy said.

“Once the coronavirus pandemic is over, and Australia no longer needs the app, the app and the information on it will be deleted permanently. No virus, no app,” Minister Hunt said.

Coronavirus is a serious and contagious respiratory disease with symptoms including fever, a dry cough, a sore throat and shortness of breath that has infected more than 2.8 million people globally and led to 200,000 deaths. In Australia around 6,700 people have contracted coronavirus and sadly 82 people have died.

The App can be downloaded from the App stores.

https://pmtranscripts.pmc.gov.au/release/transcript-42799

Interview with Oliver Peterson, 6PR

24 April 2020

OLIVER PETERSON: Welcome to Perth Live.

PRIME MINISTER: G’day Ollie, it’s good to be with you, look, thanks to all the West Australians for the great job they're doing. We're getting ahead of this and we wouldn't have got there without everybody's efforts and, you know, been working closely with the Premier, Mark McGowan. It's been great to have him as part of the National Cabinet. And look, as you say, there's no teams in all of this, just one. Team Australia.

PETERSON: WA schools are set to reopen for term two on Wednesday, Prime Minister, there is understandably still some apprehension in the community. But what's the health advice you’re able to pass on and assist children getting back into the classrooms next week?

PRIME MINISTER: Safe to be at school for kids. It's that- that's been the same advice all along. And when it comes to teachers and how we set up the schools, the 1.5 meters for kids in classrooms and the four square metre rules. They don't, that recommendation, the advice is that's not necessary in the classrooms. And so the kids can go back to school, they can go in the classrooms, they can learn in the classrooms, that’s the best place for kids to be at school, learning in a classroom.

PETERSON: We also, though, hear from some of the state school teachers' unions, like here in WA, the Independent and Catholic Schools Associations, they are providing a little bit of mixed messaging at the moment. They're telling parents that if they can keep their children at home, they should do that. So is there any further advice or update, Prime Minister, you can help to alleviate some of those fears that our teachers might have?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, first of all, that advice that they're providing is not based on the medical advice. The medical advice is it's safe for kids to be at school. And so anyone suggesting otherwise, that is in contradiction to what the expert medical panel and the Chief Health Officer of the Western Australia, in South Australia, right across the country, our Chief Health Medical Officer. That's the advice we've consistently had. So it is safe for kids to go back. What we have to be careful of in the schools is for teachers’ health is that they, like anyone going back into work, whether they're in an office or in a, you know, on a factory floor or something like that, that the social distancing principles are observed between the adult population, so for pick up and drop off, well, that's going to have to be observed at the schools. But the teachers' risk is in the staff room, not in the classroom and that's where the normal practices would have to be employed like they would in any office, which is like is being employed in my office here.

PETERSON: You talk about getting back to working and getting more people back to work. Have you got a time frame on that, Prime Minister?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, ASAP. Subject to what's happening with the health advice. In many areas that is happening right now and in many areas, you'll see people starting to go back to work in their offices. You'll see retail shops opening up again. You'll see all of this happening. But it'll be different. And we will have learnt a lot during this period of where we've been in isolation or staying at home. I think people should have their built in instinctiveness around, you know, the social distancing and those sorts of things. And you go into retail shops, as it already is if you’re going into some of those big shops or just the small ones for that matter, they're already practising these things. So we can go back in what I'd call a sort of a more COVID-safe environment, whether it's in the workplace or whether it's elsewhere in the community.

PETERSON: Do you think we'll get to a stage this winter where young boys and girls will be playing netball, footy or social community sport?

PRIME MINISTER: I hope so. That's certainly what I'd like to see, and particularly outdoors. Indoors, it presents more of a risk for obvious reasons. But outdoors, that'd be great to see that happen. I can't tell you how soon, but today at the National Cabinet we agreed to get a set of principles together nationally for that, as well as for elite sport, which is, you know, our Olympic sort of level sport as well as our professional codes. But also for recreation, you know, people going for a walk in the bush or going for a surf or a paddle or wherever they happen to do, riding bikes or that sort of thing. That's that's all part of it. And it’s an important element of our way of life in Australia. But look, we just want to get back to the way of life that we know as soon as we can, but we're not going to be silly about it and we're going to have the common sense rules in place to ensure that we don't see the break out in the virus that has devastated so many countries. I mean, in France, they have a death rate compared to Australia which is a hundred times higher. Now, that's a sophisticated developed economy with a good health system. So, you know, we're not immune from this virus running rampant in Australia and we can't be complacent about, when it comes to protecting Australian's health.

PETERSON: And you talked last week about those 3 criteria required to ease these restrictions, a testing regime, the tracing capability, the local response. So who is going to qualify for COVID 19 tests and will frontline workers be included in that when the track and tracing app is also going to be made available? Prime Minister, should that be downloaded by all Australians in the next week or two? Do you imagine it'll be available soon?

PRIME MINISTER: Yes, I do. And it will be available very soon. And I would, I would just ask Australians to do that, to download it. I mean, we talk about what can you do to say thank you to those health workers? Well you can download the app. What can you do to keep yourself safe? In a COVID safe workplace? Well you can download the app. How does that protect your family? Well, downloading the app means that if someone's been in contact with you, which has had Coronavirus, you'll find out, and you'll find out sooner, which means you can take decisions which protects other people and your data is completely safe. The only person is going to see it is the health officer who would be ringing the person who has contracted coronavirus and asking you for exactly the same information. Getting it off your phone just means it's going to happen sooner. It's going to happen more accurately. And it's going to mean that we're able to contact those individuals who have been exposed, and make sure we can isolate them as well so others don't get sick. So it's, that's what it's for. That's the only, that's the only job it has.

PETERSON: Prime Minister on aged care centres, I’m disturbed by a lot of the correspondence I’m receiving from my listeners because they're being locked out from visiting frail loved ones, particularly those who are suffering with dementia or Alzheimer's. It's just heartbreaking, but you're going to intervene?

PRIME MINISTER: Yeah, it's not okay. I mean, we said originally, and our view hasn't changed, and this is the expert medical advice that there can be visits to people in nursing homes, in aged care facilities. And it would, it should happen. It can happen twice a day or thereabouts. It happened in the residents rooms. And it's for those who, you know, they would see regularly. So it might be a loved one, a carer, a support person who would normally be doing that. We're not saying there should be 20 people in their room and the entire extended family. No, that was not what was proposed. But these other contacts are very important to these residents and it affects the quality of their lives and they should have access to that. And we have never recommended that that should be taken away from them. We left it to the discretion of aged care facilities to exercise their judgement on these things. And disappointingly, there have been a few too many cases where this has been a bit overzealous. And so unless there's, the sector can get it sorted out, well, we will require aged care facilities to apply for an exemption to the access that people should ordinarily have. And if there's an outbreak like we've had that in Tasmania, we've had a couple here in New South Wales. On the other, on the East Coast. Well, yeah you've got to lock down those. You've got to deal with outbreaks. That's common sense. But otherwise, it should be okay.

PETERSON: Turning our attention to ANZAC day, it's gonna be very different tomorrow, but possibly even more special. I think hundreds of thousands of Australians are going to light a candle, stand at the end of their driveway, because Prime Minister, were you aware that the most downloaded song, on iTunes in Australia this week has been the last post?

PRIME MINISTER: Yeah, I was. And I think that's awesome. And it shows that Australians are thinking about how they're going to celebrate Anzac Day this year to commemorate Anzac Day and to, in a in a COVID world. And I think that's tremendous. And I'm not surprised, in the same way people get up early on Anzac Day and put themselves out to go and do that as a mark of honour and respect and remembrance. Well, they're thinking about other ways they can do that this year. And I just think that's awesome. And I reckon our diggers past and present will be pretty proud of that and and having a bit of a smile about it. And that's that's great. Let's not forget on Anzac Day, too, that so many of our veterans who get together on that day won't be able to do that this year. And so let's just make you know, put a post on on your social media just saying thank you for your service or if you know a veteran who lives in his street or something like that, just let them know that you're thinking about them and you appreciate them. Because, you know, I think it's wonderful on Anzac Day and I know they appreciate it when they hear from, just you know, rank and file Australians. Thank you for your service. It means a lot to them, we should say it every day, not just on Anzac Day.

PETERSON: Absolutely. Can we use the speakers do you reckon tomorrow morning? Can you give us a little bit of permission to go beyond the local councils or local rangers? You know, noise restrictions come into effect from 7:00 a.m., But if it's 6 a.m., if I'm blasting the last post at a reasonable level through my speakers in the street, I'm not going to get a knock on the door am I prime minister?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, I'd certainly hope not. I mean, there was a great Western Australian who became Prime Minister. And Bob Hawke has said anyone who does that or anyone who was, you know, given a hard time over something like that by someone, they'd be a bum! So I reckon it's a bit of the same thing here. I'm sure people will look the other way on that thing. I've probably just earned the ire of every local mayor in Perth, but, or elsewhere. But I reckon you should be up 6.00am, light up the dawn. I'll be at the commemorative service at the War Memorial at 5:30am on the East Coast. That might be a little early for for the West Coast, but I'm sure that is being relayed at the appropriate time in the West.

PETERSON: It sure is, Prime Minister. Really appreciate your time this afternoon on Perth Live. Thank you very much.

PRIME MINISTER: Well, thank you to all those Western Australians doing an awesome job. Let's keep doing it Australia.

https://pmtranscripts.pmc.gov.au/release/transcript-42797

Interview with Ben Fordham, 2GB

24 April 2020

BEN FORDHAM: Prime Minister Scott Morrison joins us live. Prime Minister, good afternoon. 

PRIME MINISTER: G’day Ben, how are you mate? 

FORDHAM: I’m good. You must be exhausted. But you must feel relieved that we're on the way out?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, we're far ahead of where we thought we would be at this time. And the people I have to thank for that and it was very kind, what you just said the, but is the Australian people and their patience and their discipline and their application, I know it's frustrating and annoying and then all of those things. But this is really delivering for Australia and making us safer, which means we can as soon as we can and more quickly every day get our economy up back and running, get people back in work, get kids back in the classroom learning directly from the teachers, have those shops open and and sport running again. And this is where we want to get back to. And we're moving there as as patiently, but as quickly as we can. 

FORDHAM: I know there have been some disagreements between the feds and the states, but I think that's understandable when you think about it. I mean, I can understand why Premiers are going to be a bit cautious on schools because they're, they're kind of carrying the baby and they're thinking if something stuffs up here, it's going to be on me. But from a federal level, you've been sending a message that that you think it's time to get back to school. We spoke to Tim Berryman at the start of the show today. He's the Principal of Fitzroy Community School. He's in an interesting spot because the official policy in Victoria is for children to be taught from home until further notice. But he says, look, I'm following the advice of the Chief Medical Officer of Australia. So he's got the kids back. 

PRIME MINISTER: Well, not just the advice of the Chief Medical Officer of Australia, but of the expert medical panel. I mean, you've got the South Australian Chief Health Officer who wrote to all of the parents in South Australia sending the same message, in Western Australia they're following that practice, in the Northern Territory, they're all back at school now in the normal way. New South Wales is going down that path. So, look, that's always been the case that schools have been safe for kids. The issue that has been raised by teachers, understandably, is how safe it is for teachers now, for teachers there, the issue is that they are more at risk to coronavirus in the staffroom than the classroom, because that's the one thing we do know about this virus, is its its impact on children is far less. It's it's very reduced. So kids are safe. And what I'm concerned about and always have been, I said very early, we are going to lose a lot during this crisis, people losing their jobs and their livelihoods and we’re seeking to hold on to as much of that as possible. But we also don't want to see a whole year of a child's education gone because you don't get to be 8 again, you don't get to be 12 again, or 17 and doing your HSC or in year 4 prep school that you're doing with the pre-school work. This is all, these are all incredibly important years -

FORDHAM: Well, with that in mind, let me ask you this, because I know there are a lot of parents who are concerned at the moment and they feel a degree of guilt. And let me talk you through that guilt, they've heard that at first it was only the children of essential workers who should be going to school. Now they're being told no we’re, we're getting things back up and running again. But there are a lot of parents who are at their wits end because they've been teaching from home. They're exhausted. They feel like they can't give what they've been giving for the past month anymore to their kids. And they also feel that their kids have been withdrawing a little bit because they're losing out on that social contact and that classroom experience. Should those parents feel at all guilty about their kids going back to school next week? 

PRIME MINISTER: No, not at all.

FORDHAM: Regardless of who they are or what they do?

PRIME MINISTER: Every job in this economy is essential. Every job is essential. It supports a livelihood. It supports an income for a family. It supports the economy. It supports every other Australian. I've never been an advocate of this essential definition. You got a job? You’re essential.

FORDHAM: Alright, I presume maternity leave would be essential as well. So if you've got a scenario where you've got a mum caring for a baby and they've been doing that, and then they've added in on top of that, looking after three or four kids as well, if that mother feels like look I need to focus on the baby for a moment, I need the other kids back at school. They can go back to school?

PRIME MINISTER: Sure. I mean, the health advice hasn't changed and that is the children are not at risk at school. Now, I agree that in the schools themselves, we've got to put the appropriate safeguards in for the teachers, but that's to protect them from each other, and to ensure that a pick up, at pick up and drop off that the you know, the social distancing rules are followed there. That's where the risks are. 

FORDHAM: Can you just elaborate on that and just send a message to parents not to feel guilty? Because I know that words come up a number of times when I've been talking to parents, they say, oh, yeah, but I oh, I want to send them back. I feel like it's the right thing to do. And I've heard from all the medical experts, but I feel guilty about it. 

PRIME MINISTER: Well, the medical experts advice is that it is safe for your children to be at school. And in terms of what we've been sort of arguing for and look, we fund predominantly the independent schools and the Catholic schools, we are 80 per cent funders of those organisations, the states do the state schools, 80 per cent. Now, what is also important is that when children go to school, they get taught in classrooms by teachers. And that is the best way for them to learn. I'm looking forward for my kids to be able to go back to school where they are taught in the classroom by the teacher. I mean, I've got wonderful teachers at the school that Jenny and I have our kids go to, they're tremendous. We respect them tremendously. And the leadership of the school, and the school board, and we're looking forward to getting back to where they, our kids are taught in the school, in a classroom by their teachers each and every day. 

FORDHAM: If you don't mind me asking, when are your kids going back? 

PRIME MINISTER: Well as soon as I can do exactly that. Exactly that. 

FORDHAM: So if you want to send your kids to back to school next week, it doesn't matter who you are, what you do, what your reasons are, 

PRIME MINISTER: Send them.

FORDHAM: Send them. As the New South Wales Premier said, there shouldn't be any questions asked about why you're choosing to do that. Just do it. I'm wondering what other kind of carrots you can dangle at people, I know that this might seem a little bit cheap, but I've got a feeling at the moment, Prime Minister, like, people need to see a bit of a light at the end of the tunnel. And yes, we've started having a few beaches open. I've got a mate called Miles. Now, you know, those mates who just chew your ear off about one subject over and over again, Miles has been saying to me. Miles’ relief in life is jumping on his motorbike, getting away from the kids and riding up to the Hawkesbury for about an hour and then riding back. He goes on his own. But you're not allowed to do that at the moment. Are there gonna be things like that? Is this something like that? Or, you know, I've got an old mate who just loves getting in the car with his wife, driving to the beach, buying a milkshake from a takeaway and sitting in the car and looking out at the waves. When can those people do those things, do you reckon? 

PRIME MINISTER: Well, I'm going to leave the specifics of that to the Premiers, because ultimately mate they make those calls. And I don't want to make their job harder. In making those difficult calls. One of the things we agreed to do today at the National Cabinet is by next week, we will have a set of national principles for sport and recreation. And what does that mean for elite sport, obviously, and professional sport? So there's a common set of ways that we can deal with that very soon. That will obviously help what is trying to be sorted out at the NRL and the AFL. For Olympic athletes and rowing and all that sort of thing, then is the community sport. The competitive sport at a local level. And that's a huge part of how our communities operate and what we love doing. And then there's the recreation side of things as well. And that is fishing, it's going for that surf for all that's walking in the national park and many, in many states they are closed. And so getting some common principles on all of those things. 

FORDHAM: And it would it, would it make sense to me to be thinking about every week or heading into every weekend or at some stage every week to be thinking, okay, we can throw just a couple more little carrots the way of Australians to say okay,

PRIME MINISTER: Sure, and that’s already happening. I want to stress, that is already happening, in New South Wales that's already happening. And I know more of that will be happening, in Western Australia that's happening, in the Northern Territory it’s already happened, in South Australia and in Tasmania they're all moving on a lot of these things already and they'll keep doing more and more in the weeks ahead. I mean, elective surgery, that was a big one, that got lift. We're seeing the changes in what's happening at schools. And I think you will see more and more of this in the weeks ahead. But the other thing that has to happen at the same time, because it's a two way street, the way we keep on top of this are 3 things. The first one is, we're doing more testing than ever before, and that is being stepped up even more where the testing regime, the coronavirus is being applied in a lot more circumstances, that means we can stay on top of it. The second is we've got to help, the second point is we've got to help those health workers who are ringing people. And when someone gets coronavirus and finding out who they've been in contact with, a very important job, you do that. You can stay on top of this thing and you can isolate those who may have been in contact and we'll be certainly soon releasing that app. Which if people download, your information, privacy, all of that is protected. The only people who gets to see what that is, is that health officer, who, the person who has coronavirus would need to tell anyway who they've been in contact with. This just speeds it up.

FORDHAM: We have been, we have been told that gyms might be one of the last frontiers as far as things re-opening. I would just raise one thing with you, with a guest this week who said to me, he runs a smaller health and fitness centre. He said, look, I hope that some of the smaller ones are able to open before we get right to the end of the line. But the other one is the pub. Now, I don’t want to put you on the spot here, but can you just, I know you're not a betting man, but mate when are the pubs reopening? Just have a punt?

PRIME MINISTER: These are some of the hardest ones, the larger gatherings and the social gatherings. I mean, one of the things that a lot of people also want to see is you know when can I have just a couple of friends over and that sort of thing? These sorts of engagements, look at the highest priority for me as Prime Minister really relates to how we get the economy up and running again, because that's what's going to ensure that people get their jobs back and they can get back to work and not be reliant on income support, through JobSeeker and JobKeeper- 

FORDHAM: Yeah I know but all these businesses are part of that economy. And they, anyway I know I know you don't have the answers to it because it's it's it's silly to even suggest that you you've got all these dates worked out because it's moving as we go. But anyway, we'll wait for the weekly updates.

PRIME MINISTER: A lot of retail shops. That's, you know where things have been shut down. I mean, that's where we're looking to try and move when we say and we talk about the baseline. But but large, people getting together in social settings, that is where it can all go pear shaped. And those figures you read out before I came on. I mean, the thing about it. In France? A hundred times the death rate than in Australia, in the UK, just under a hundred times the death rate, and those terrible figures you read out from Netherlands and Belgium and places like that. This thing moves fast, if you let it get away from you. And we've done so well to get on top of it. And you don't want to have a stop-start recovery. You want to just keep building it up and improving each and every day. 

FORDHAM: We appreciate your leadership. And I'd say the same about all the state and territory leaders. I think at the end of this whole thing, you all deserve a medal. Thank you so much. 

PRIME MINISTER: Thanks mate and a shout out to Glenn Wheeler, whose birthday it was, 60 this week. 

FORDHAM: He looks older than that. 

PRIME MINISTER: He sounded good though, it was great to him. All the best mate.

FORDHAM: Good on you mate, Scott Morrison our Prime Minister.

https://pmtranscripts.pmc.gov.au/release/transcript-42796

Interview with Kieran Gilbert, Sky News

24 April 2020

KIERAN GILBERT: Prime Minister, thank you for your time. You must be feeling a lot better today than you were after the last or the first National Cabinet six weeks ago. We're in a much better situation as a nation, aren't we?

PRIME MINISTER: We are. And we're ahead of where we thought we would be. I think that's very pleasing. And we've got Australians to thank for that. We took some very quick decisions back then, well informed by the medical expert panel and we've acted on those and we've been getting the results we were hoping to get. But now we're in another phase of this and it will present its own challenges. Having got through the first wave I talked about today, which was that export of the virus from China all around the world and we did very well there. The second wave was all the Australians coming home from all of those places where they saw much higher levels of infection. And now we're dealing with the risk of community outbreaks and we're on top of that. But we can't be complacent.

GILBERT: Can we eliminate this thing, can we get rid of it entirely? 

PRIME MINISTER: Well, that's possible. And the medical experts say the same thing, and that's possible even from what we're doing. But this whole idea of if you pursue an eradication strategy, as it's called, well, that is basically everyone getting in under the doona and not not getting out. And that you can't run a country like that. 

GILBERT: Is it your overriding thought now that you just want to avoid a misstep, a calamity like we have seen internationally? You spoke about the numbers this week and it's jolting when you hear some of the death rates in Sweden, in Belgium, the Netherlands. Is that your overriding thought now to avoid any misstep, that sense in that direction? 

PRIME MINISTER: Well, at two levels, you're right. I mean, that the death rate in France is 100 times higher per million population than in Australia. I mean, in the UK, just less than that. They are horrifying figures. And so what that says is that this virus has a rate of transmission that is quite frightening. If it gets going, it's very hard to stop and without quite extreme measures. And so that's one level of concern that I and then the rest of the National Cabinet have. The other one is that one on the road back, we just want to stay on the right track. You don't want to stop and go, stop and go. That has a real negative economic consequence to it as well. So, you know, building up iteratively, step by step by step, carefully pursued. And one of the interesting things today is we sort of had this discussion that, you know, obviously the Northern Territory in Western Australian and South Australia, well, things are going incredibly well. And I can understand why people living in those parts of the country are going to well, why can't we just go completely back to normal now? And they're asking those questions. But other parts of the country, I mean, what's happened to Tasmania? A very quick outbreak which had really taken quite a bit of effort to get under control. 

GILBERT: So we're in this period of consolidation now, almost in a holding pattern really, for three weeks. Are you sure this is the right way to go or can we start taking some of those measures off faster? Because as you know better than anyone, I mean, you've been reporting these statistics to the Australian people, how many people who've lost their jobs. It's hurting. 

PRIME MINISTER: It is hurting and it is hurting hard. And we want to prevent that going forward, too. And, look, we already are seeing those changes, though. I mean, yes, there is formally another three weeks before we pencilled in that decision on what we call the baseline measures. But already states are moving on a range of things which were well beyond the baselines. And, you know, if there's an opportunity to move a day earlier, then I can assure you will take it. But what we don't want to do is get that decision wrong and then several weeks from now, having to lock everything back down much harder. I mean, the cost of restarting your business, getting your people back and getting the kids back to school, you know, we've already gone through that traumatic change of going into that phase we're in now. If you had to open up and shut, open up and shut, well, that has a cost to it, which I think would leave us in a far worse position. 

GILBERT: And in terms of the app, the tracing app, because this is what you describe as the industrial sort of tracing capacity. When are we going to see it? And I guess, what's your message to people who are watching us this afternoon saying, I want to do my bit, I want to do my bit for our health as a nation to deal with this pandemic. But I'm worried about the privacy implications. What do you say to reassure them? 

PRIME MINISTER: Well, first, don't be. I mean, what we've done here has been very careful. This has one job, you know, has got one job. It's got one job and that is to help that health officer sitting in that office in Sydney or Melbourne or wherever they happen to be and what happens if... let's say you contract coronavirus. What would normally happen is the health officer would speak to you and say, well, Kieran, who were you in contact with over this period of time? This is information you would be volunteering up on the best of your recollection. But none of us are perfect and none of us are keeping a diary of every single movement that we're making. Now what this simply does is helps you in that situation because you give the authority for those contacts that you would have had during that precise period to be downloaded to that health officer. They’re the only people who are going to see it. So, you know, I hear a lot of people say and rightly, you know, I want to thank those health officers, the people on the front line, those working in the supermarkets, those working in aged care facilities. What can I do to help them? Download the app. Download the app. We’ve put the protections in place and you download that app, you're making yourself safer, you’re keeping your family safer, you’re making your community safer and it means we can get back to where we want to be. 

GILBERT: And do you think we'll get to that 40 per cent benchmark, which was the figure that we heard earlier in the piece as the key number to make this thing worthwhile, this app. Will we get to that 40 per cent? 

PRIME MINISTER: I don't know, that's up to Australians. That's a question only Australians can answer. The right answer to that question is to get it as high as possible and so we're asking Australians, will you support that national effort? It's a pretty straightforward question. And I will be, I'll be downloading it and I encourage everyone else to. And we've put the protections in place. We've actually listened very carefully. We just didn't one day turn up and say, well, here's the app. We said we were going to have one. And then we've been in this process now over several weeks, listening carefully to what people's concerns about it would be. And we've been addressing it. And so what we will be able to launch very soon is to have this tool, and that's all it is. It's a tool, a tool to help health workers do their job to keep you safe. 

GILBERT: We've seen the data on kids, particularly school aged kids. It's minuscule, the impact on them. It frustrates you, doesn't it, that the schools aren't all open? 

PRIME MINISTER: Well, the health advice has been consistently clear from day one. And it was one of the first unusual things we observed about the coronavirus out of what we saw in China. And that was that it wasn't impacting children in the way that influenza virus affects children. And what we learnt back then, and that was China data, and that this was where in the cases that did happen, they caught it from their parents and those who they were living with at home. And so this has been... there are many things we don't know about this virus. But one thing we do know is what it's doing amongst children. And so that is why schools are the obvious place for us to move back to normal as quickly as possible.

GILBERT: And would you like the unions to be more cooperative on that, because they did work effectively with the government, didn't they, on the JobKeeper payment and so on. It seems the teachers unions aren't being as cooperative, not as cooperative as we saw from the ACTU and others.

PRIME MINISTER: They make a point, which is reasonable, that their workplace has to be safe. But as I said, their risk is not in the classroom. Their risk is in the staff room. Now, that's no different to, you know, you and I going to work here. I mean, we've got people who are going to work in supermarkets every day. We've got people who are doing jobs all over the community, driving buses, and they're doing great work and they're turning up to work to do those things. And the health advice is very clear. I mean, these things can be managed. The one and a half metre and the four square metre in the classroom, that is not required based on the health advice. So suggestions that are coming from that group that this is necessary, well, that’s just not true. That's not a credible requirement. They need to ensure that they've got social distancing happening in the lunch room and the staff room and a drop off and pick up in their engagement with parents, sure, of course, they do. But the retailers are doing the same thing right now. People are doing it in manufacturing plants, on construction sites. Workers are doing it. And we need these COVID-safe working environments and today we agreed those principles, national principles, for how when people are, whether it's in an office or anywhere else, that if there are cases or on a dock, we've dealt with those things on wharves as well, that we can quickly rehabilitate those sites and get them operating again. 

GILBERT: What's your message to the 800,000 plus individuals who've lost their jobs in the face of this crisis?  Have you got a message of hope for them that we're coming back? 

PRIME MINISTER: We’re coming back. We're on the road back, and it is our hope that you'll spend as little time as possible on the income support of the JobSeeker program or the JobKeeper program, depending on what your circumstances are. We have built these income supports as being temporary because we know they will only need to be there on a temporary basis because this is a temporary situation we're going through. Devastating, hard, awful. But, Kieran, one of the things I've been most impressed about by Australians is how they have reacted to this, this terrible disruption to their lives. How patient they've been in the vast majority of cases of people at Centrelink or just sort of getting it, this is hard for everybody and understanding they're just doing their job, everyone's trying to help each other. This is why I think tomorrow on ANZAC Day that I reckon I reckon the diggers would be pretty proud of what they've seen from so many Australians at the moment. 

GILBERT: It's been very impressive. No doubt about that. And in terms of this, just a couple of things before you go.

PRIME MINISTER: Sure.

GILBERT: On the reform phase. The Government has to be bold here, doesn't it? And you're saying you're looking at these things with a fresh, fresh set of eyes. It's a harvest period to look at these things. But you have to be bold here, don’t you, because we're not facing a regular sort of downturn.

PRIME MINISTER: Whether it's what I've said, what Dr Lowe has said at the Reserve Bank or Dr Kennedy as Head of Treasury. We understand that the economy we're going to move into is going to require different things of Australian businesses, a flexibility that they may have been constrained in before. They're going to need to be able to invest and invest heavily to get the growth that we need for our economy. And so, yeah, of course. This is a unique set of challenges we've got here. And just trying to put the round pegs into square holes of what that new economy will be won't work. So we need to think through those things carefully. That's why, you know, we've bought ourselves quite a bit of time to get this right. And we are engaging in a consultative way and what Nev Power and his coordination commission is doing - really helpful. I mean, they've got no barrows to push. They’re not lobbying for this or that. They've just got a world of experience that is enormously helpful to us. But working with, I mean, Greg Combet is on there, he’s doing an awesome job. David Thodey and Jane Holton has, you know, worked in the medical side of things, on bank boards. You know, they're just great Australians who are very passionate about what they're doing. When I rang them up and asked them to be part of this I said, can you serve your country? And they said absolutely. 

GILBERT: This is not a gotcha question. It's a genuine question to see if this is the sort of breadth of what you're looking at. Because I know you looked at the GST and the potential for lifting it where, you know, during the previous prime minister's term. Is that how far we're looking here in terms of, you know, the fresh eyes? Does it extend to that? Because a lot of economists say you need that breadth sort of revenue, basically. 

PRIME MINISTER: Well, look, I again, I haven't been drawn on on any of these things, and no one should be making any conclusions based on that response. What has been done, Kieran, and over the last decade and arguably more, is there's been a lot of proposals made that were done at different times and may not have suited those times in terms of what was achievable. The Productivity Commission has done a lot of work and people heard me refer to the Shifting the Dial Report, something I commissioned when I was Treasurer. Now, that doesn't mean everything in there is potentially achievable at the moment, but there's just been a lot of work. My point about making that observation is we’re not working from scratch here. When I say we’re at a harvest, well, let's put all this stuff on the table again and let's look at the things that we think can best work. But what are we trying to achieve? Jobs, investment, growth. You do those three things. You don’t have to put people's taxes up to get the revenue. You do those three things, your revenues will grow and you'll be out there again. And, you know, you’ve got to deal with resources issues, energy issues, all of these things. But in the midst of this awful time, there is a way through here for Australia that could lead us to be in a much stronger position in the future and particularly to be more competitive than perhaps we've known in a long time. 

GILBERT: We certainly hope so. And just last question, and you touched on it, but ANZAC Day tomorrow. A time of isolation and I guess it's going to be a quiet, you know, a quiet sense of solidarity, isn't it tomorrow?

PRIME MINISTER: It's going to be very moving, I think. None of us would have experienced this before and there will be a quiet reflection. And I just love this idea of Australians all over the country standing at the end of their driveway, standing in their apartment, looking out the window with a light, a connection between every Australian. Even though we all turn up on dawn services, this is in the one initiative. And that will be a time of unity that I doubt we've ever experienced before on that sort of scale. And that will be quite unique. But I just hope from it when we reflect on all and we all know we're all passionate about the service of Australians overseas and over the many generations. And we all have those particular stories that we might know more than others. I mean, for me this year and the anniversary of Sandakan and the death march and the isolation of those diggers who had to walk to their deaths, and I've retraced those steps, as you know, with Jason Clare many year ago. The isolation they felt and the strength they were able to exhibit in the worst of circumstances - if they can do that, we can do anything. 

GILBERT: Sure can. Appreciate your time and well, obviously, it's going to be a difficult few months ahead, but we're in a good place. 

PRIME MINISTER: Better than most, let’s keep it that way.

GILBERT: Thanks, Prime Minister.

https://pmtranscripts.pmc.gov.au/release/transcript-42795

Update on Coronavirus Measures

24 April 2020

The National Cabinet met today to take further decisions to save lives, and to save livelihoods.

The Chief Medical Officer Professor Brendan Murphy provided an update on the measures underway, the latest data and medical advice in relation to COVID-19.

There are over 6,670 confirmed cases in Australia and sadly 78 people have died.

It is clear that the suppression strategy for the virus is working. National Cabinet again noted data that confirms the measures put in place to suppress the virus have largely been successful in slowing and reversing the growth of cases in Australia, to ensure our health system has the capability to manage the epidemic.

It is estimated that approximately 93 per cent of all symptomatic cases are detected in Australia. Australia has the highest reported detection rate in the world.

Australia’s border and quarantine arrangements have successfully reduced transmission of COVID-19 from overseas arrivals, with the focus now on containing domestic outbreaks in local communities through rapid responses. The infection rate of imported cases is now 99 per cent less than local cases, due to these measures.

Domestic outbreaks if left uncontained have the potential to spread fast and overwhelm local health systems. This highlights the importance of enhanced testing, tracing and rapid containment health responses when outbreaks occur. Domestic transmission of asymptomatic cases and those with mild symptoms is a priority for National Cabinet.

As a next step in our response, National Cabinet agreed to expand testing criteria across Australia to all people with mild symptoms of COVID-19. This will ensure cases are quickly identified.

Further work to plan for enhanced monitoring, testing and tracing is underway through the development of the Pandemic Health Intelligence Plan and an Australian National Disease Surveillance Plan sitting under the Australian Health Sector Emergency Response Plan for Novel Coronavirus (COVID-19).

National Cabinet further passed a motion of condolence to the Victorian police officers killed in the line of service.

National Cabinet agreed to meet again on 1 May 2020.

COVID-19 Modelling

For COVID-19 suppression strategies to be effective, Reff  (the number of people a single case infects on average) needs to be less than 1.0.

The results of the nowcasting pandemic model produced by the University of Melbourne (Doherty Institute) continue to look very encouraging.

National Cabinet received an updated briefing on new modelling with the Reff now below 1.0 across all states and territories, except for Tasmania. Australia’s case detection rate is 93 per cent and projections of case numbers are below lower bound modelled estimates.

The modelling has been refined, reflecting the success in reducing transmission from overseas arrivals and local outbreaks. Without mitigation, local outbreaks have the potential to significantly increase case numbers and overwhelm health systems.

Updated statement on schools

National Cabinet agreed with updated Australian Health Protection Principal Committee (AHPPC) advice on schools.

AHPPC noted that among many measures, smaller class sizes might reduce the potential risk of COVID-19 transmission in schools.

AHPPC does not believe however, that the ‘venue density rule’ of no more than one person per four square metres is appropriate or practical in classrooms or corridors, nor maintaining 1.5 metre between students during classroom activities.

This clarification complements AHPPC’s advice on reducing the potential risk of COVID-19 transmission in schools (published 16 April).

AHPPC continues to note that there is very limited evidence of transmission between children in the school environment and population screening overseas has shown very low incidence of positive cases in school-aged children. In Australia, 2.4 per cent of confirmed cases have been in children aged between 5 and 18 years of age (as at 6am, 22 April 2020).  AHPPC believes that adults in the school environment should practice room density measures (such as in staff rooms) given the greater risk of transmission between adults.’

Masks

National Cabinet noted the AHPPC advice that wearing of face masks by the general population is not currently recommended. Should significant community transmission in Australia occur, mask wearing in public is an available option.

Aged Care Response

National Cabinet again discussed the outbreaks of COVID-19 in residential aged care facilities and the critical importance of balancing infection prevention and control measures against the needs and best interests of residents.

National Cabinet stressed the AHPPC advice that it is not acceptable for any facility to put in place restrictions beyond the principles agreed on 17 March 2020. These include complete lockdowns or banning all visits from carers and families, other than during a specified facility outbreak.

Facilities are best placed to know the appropriate levels of infection control and prevention to implement, in consultation with the relevant public health units and the Aged Care Quality and Safety Commission. The Commonwealth Government will continue to monitor the situation and will take steps, if necessary, to require facilities to seek an exemption from the Commission before implementing additional restrictions.

Sport and recreational activities

National Cabinet agreed that the AHPPC will develop, for consideration, key principles for the recommencement of community and professional sport, and recreational activities.

National Safe Workplace Principles

National Cabinet agreed to develop nationally-consistent, industry-specific work health and safety guidance on COVID-19, accessible via a central hub provided by Safe Work Australia.

The guidance will be developed and endorsed through Safe Work Australia, working with its members (the Commonwealth, states and territories, employer groups, and unions). The guidance will be housed on a revamped Safe Work Australia website.

Australian workplaces will be able to use this central hub of WHS guidance and tools to help manage health and safety risks posed by COVID-19.

To support the development of nationally-consistent guidance, National Cabinet agreed the ‘National COVID-19 Safe Workplace Principles’ (Attachment A).

ATTACHMENT A

National COVID-19 safe workplace principles

Recognising that the COVID-19 pandemic is a public health emergency, that all actions in respect of COVID-19 should be founded in expert health advice and that the following principles operate subject to the measures agreed and implemented by Governments through the National Cabinet process

1. All workers, regardless of their occupation or how they are engaged, have the right to a healthy and safe working environment.

2. The COVID-19 pandemic requires a uniquely focused approach to work health and safety (WHS) as it applies to businesses, workers and others in the workplace.

3. To keep our workplaces healthy and safe, businesses must, in consultation with workers, and their representatives, assess the way they work to identify, understand and quantify risks and to implement and review control measures to address those risks.

4. As COVID-19 restrictions are gradually relaxed, businesses, workers and other duty holders must work together to adapt and promote safe work practices, consistent with advice from health authorities, to ensure their workplaces are ready for the social distancing and exemplary hygiene measures that will be an important part of the transition.

5. Businesses and workers must actively control against the transmission of COVID-19 while at work, consistent with the latest advice from the Australian Health Protection Principal Committee, including considering the application of a hierarchy of appropriate controls where relevant.

6. Businesses and workers must prepare for the possibility that there will be cases of COVID-19 in the workplace and be ready to respond immediately, appropriately, effectively and efficiently, and consistent with advice from health authorities.

7. Existing state and territory jurisdiction of WHS compliance and enforcement remains critical. While acknowledging individual variations across WHS laws mean approaches in different parts of the country may vary, to ensure business and worker confidence, a commitment to a consistent national approach is key, including a commitment to communicating what constitutes best practice in prevention, mitigation and response to the risks presented by COVID-19.

8. Safe Work Australia (SWA), through its tripartite membership, will provide a central hub of WHS guidance and tools that Australian workplaces can use to successfully form the basis of their management of health and safety risks posed by COVID-19.

9. States and territories ultimately have the role of providing advice, education, compliance and enforcement of WHS and will leverage the use of the SWA central hub in fulfilling their statutory functions.

10. The work of the National COVID-19 Coordination Commission will complement the work of SWA, jurisdictions and health authorities to support industries more broadly to respond to the COVID-19 pandemic appropriately, effectively and safely.

https://pmtranscripts.pmc.gov.au/release/transcript-43979

WA's Biggest Road Project, Northlink, Open, Finished and Ready for Business

23 April 2020

Prime Minister, Minister for Population Cities and Urban Infrastructure, Attorney-General, Minister for Industrial Relations, Premier of Western Australia, Minister for Transport and Planning

The biggest road infrastructure project in WA’s history, the $1.02 billion NorthLink WA is now fully open, providing a free-flowing link between Morley and Muchea, doubling road capacity and improving journey times and productivity.

Road users travelling from Kewdale to Muchea can now avoid up to 16 sets of traffic lights, two railway crossings and 21 speed limit changes.

Prime Minister Scott Morrison said the third and final section of the project – a 22-kilometre dual carriageway highway between Ellenbrook and Muchea – will transform how traffic enters and exits Perth from the state’s north.

“The opening of the final section means road users, particularly freight, can now realise the full benefits of the 37-kilometre highway,” the Prime Minister said.

“NorthLink WA has also supported around 7000 direct and indirect jobs for Western Australians throughout its construction.”

Premier of Western Australia Mark McGowan said the government has a huge pipeline of infrastructure planned for the north-eastern suburbs of Perth, including several major road upgrades and the METRONET Morley-Ellenbrook Line, that will help ease congestion and mean less time spent on our roads.

“These are vital job-creating projects that will ensure WA is well-placed to respond in the economic recovery stage of the pandemic,” Mr McGowan said.

Federal Minister for Population, Cities and Urban Infrastructure Alan Tudge said NorthLink WA was a vital, state-of-the-art transport link between Morley and Muchea that would support the north of Perth for generations.

“So many areas of Perth will benefit, for example it will divert 80 per cent of heavy vehicles away from local roads and improving connection throughout the Swan Valley for residents and the 600,000 tourists visiting the area each year,” Mr Tudge said.

“The Morrison Government have prioritised the importance of keeping vital infrastructure projects on track through the COVID-19 crisis.”

Western Australian Minister for Transport and Planning Rita Saffioti said the new Tonkin Highway will be capable of carrying more than double the current number of vehicles.

“A round trip between the major freight hubs of Kewdale and Muchea will save around 20 minutes, which is a great boost to productivity,” Ms Saffioti said.

“Around 3200 trucks a day will be removed from Great Northern Highway south of Stock Road, which will provide a huge relief to residents, growers, tourism businesses and visitors in the Swan Valley.

“NorthLink WA has been a major feat of collaboration across successive governments, having initially been funded in the 2013 Federal Budget as the Swan Valley Bypass, and continued under the current State and Federal governments.”

Federal Member for Pearce Christian Porter said the project would also significantly reduce heavy vehicle traffic on Great Northern Highway through the Swan Valley tourism region, enabling a safer road environment for visitors and local businesses.

“One of the many benefits of NorthLink WA’s latest section is that it will take trucks and heavy vehicles off Great Northern Highway, reducing congestion and making roads safer along the beautiful Swan Valley,” Mr Porter said.

“Our northern suburbs have always been great places to live and work, but the unprecedented investment behind key infrastructure projects like NorthLink WA has made them even more accessible and primed for future growth.”

Cyclists and pedestrians can now access a four-metre-wide Principal Shared Path, from Railway Parade in Bayswater to Muchea ¬ a distance of around 42 kilometres.

Traffic speeds (outside work zones) are 100 kilometres an hour to Ellenbrook and 110 kilometres an hour between Ellenbrook and Muchea, reducing travel times significantly and improving both safety and the driving experience for motorists.

Finishing works are still underway, so please pay careful attention to the new configuration and obey the signage.

The NorthLink WA project was jointly funded with the Australian Government providing $820.84 million and the Western Australian Government $204.06 million.

Footage of the Northlink project can be downloaded here: https://drive.google.com/open?id=17xA3ZssfRiroUlkGsQsGe6l-V9vMp4Xy

https://pmtranscripts.pmc.gov.au/release/transcript-42792

Interview with Paul Murray, Sky News

22 April 2020

PRIME MINISTER: G’day Paul, how are you mate?

PAUL MURRAY: Very good. Now, a few weeks ago, you told the nation that Jenny bought an awful lot of puzzles and I just wanted to check in, has she done them all? And what are some of the small, or silly, or simply very normal things that you’re doing to get the Morrison family through this?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, no they're not finished yet, but they're making great progress and they were a good purchase, and friends of ours have also taken up this hobby and they’re sending us, we're getting lots of pictures from friends doing puzzles, which it is nice to see people are taking up the the option. But no, look, we've done things like, you know, Jenny was doing veggie gardens with the girls and they're doing lots of drawings and, of course, a few weeks ago when before holidays, obviously, they had their school online and those sorts of things. But, you know, you get together as a family and you talk about things that are going on. We're looking forward to Anzac Day and while I'll be, of course, be at the commemorative service, the Dawn Service there at 5:30 down at the War Memorial, Jen and I, I mean our kids will be out there lighting up the dawn like everyone else at 6:00. And I think that's a really good initiative, the way to bring everyone together on Anzac Day. I mean, it will be different. Of course it will be different. But what matters won’t have changed, and that is to honour and remember the sacrifice and service. And it will be, I think, a very moving time. I think we'll draw a lot of strength from it. But, you know, getting together as a family is very important at any time, and particularly during times like this and like any other family, that's exactly what we're doing. My daughter and I, we've been watching a few Star Wars films on the weekend and I've been introducing her to that series and that's been a lot of fun.

MURRAY: You spoke to President Trump today, did he ask many about what we’re doing in Australia, because obviously our situation is much better than theirs.

PRIME MINISTER: Yeah, look, he did, and he was very interested. He always is when we speak about what's happening in Australia and I welcome that and he had noticed that we were doing particularly well and we talked about what was happening here. One of the things we discussed in particular was the fact that we both made the decision at about the same time to ensure that we blocked off those incoming visits from China, mainland China. That was quite critical in our story and in those early weeks. I mean, we only had one case at the time, I think, when we made that decision and the United States did the same thing. And what that meant was, particularly through our Chinese Australian communities and they went into self isolation when those Australian residents and citizens came home, and that ensured that we pretty much prevented that first wave. Now, that didn't occur in Europe and what's happening in Europe is just heartbreaking. And those flights were going into all of those countries, including in the UK and we've seen what's happened. So we reflected on that experience. I mean, about half of the States, the President told me, have a low level of coronavirus infection. But the other half, of course, particularly in the tri-state area around Chicago and so on, they've got some very, very, very difficult challenges there. So we're able to share those experiences and he was pretty impressed with what Australia's doing, I’ve got to say.

MURRAY: You also spoke to Bill Gates, was he offering advice, asking questions or telling you to lay off the WHO?

PRIME MINISTER: Oh, look, Bill and I, I think, shared a view on the WHO. And that is on the ground, they do some very effective work. And look, I think that position is understood more broadly too, including the United States. And so obviously we will continue to support them, but they run a lot of vaccination research programs and I was talking to Bill and he was asking us about what we're doing on the vaccination research side of things and so I could obviously talk about the work that was been done at UQ and the CSIRO and the Doherty Institute and Australia's got a very strong story to tell there and the tens of millions we're putting into vaccine research and being part of other global efforts. I mean, his Foundation is doing a lot really good work on identifying those that have a pretty reasonable likelihood of being able to make the most progress and we're happy to support those international initiatives as well. We're all trying to find that vaccine, and that's the thing that ultimately deals with this thing. In the meantime, we've got to deal with keeping it under control, which I mean, today, four cases. That's an extraordinary achievement for Australia. We're making great progress on keeping that number below 1, the Reff, which is the key indicator, and we keep that going, we're on the road back.

MURRAY: It’s the new curve. Now about the World Health Organisation, you’ve been very clear about some of their limitations here but you’re also trying to lead an international consensus about the where to from here. I saw today there was a suggestion that you believe that the World Health Organisation should have a power that other UN organisations have, essentially to be like weapons inspectors where it’s not an option whether they’re able to enter a country at a time like this. Do you think that’s where we need to go?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, a couple of points. The first one, when I've had these discussions with other leaders, there's a clear view that we need to have a transparent and independent process to look at what's gone on here. And importantly, even more importantly, what are the things that need to change and one doesn't necessarily have to follow the other. I mean, it could take some time to get that independent process to look at the origins of this and how it occurred and the lessons to be learned. But I do think there are immediately things that can improve. And that is, I mean, one of the things that would have been very helpful to the rest of the world is if there wasn't any delay and if there was the ability to get this information very early on that could have alerted the rest of the world to the greater risk that was occurring there. It did take a while. And I don't make that comment to be critical. It's just an observation, and I personally think it would be very helpful that in circumstances, and it wouldn’t matter if it was in Australia, if it was in South America, if it was in Southeast Asia or Africa or China or anywhere else, in Europe. That if there is a virus of this nature that is believed to be of pandemic potential and very dangerous to the world, well we need to know what's going on and fast, very fast and if we have that ability, that could have potentially saved thousands, if not hundreds of thousands, of lives. And we need to have that sort of ability and so that's why yeah I am an advocate of that case. Now, the other countries as yet, they won’t have formed a view on my specific proposals. But the broader area of cooperation, independent, transparent, getting to the heart of what's happened here so we can learn the lessons, that's incredibly important. I mean, after the Ebola episode, the WHO had an independent review of all that, they had a whole series of recommendations about what should change and nothing was changed. And I don't think we can have a repeat of that exercise and so like-minded countries like France and ourselves and Germany and I'm sure, as yet, when I next get to speak to Boris in the UK and Canada and the United States and so many, we have a lot in common here. And we need to ensure there's transparency, that there is independence and getting to the bottom of these things and getting world global organisations, which have their place, they can do really good work. But they've got to be able to do that without, you know, being fettered in any way in the way they find out what's going on so the rest of us can take action.

MURRAY: Do you care if we offend China at all at the moment?

PRIME MINISTER: It's not about that. I mean, it's about knowing what happened and it's about ensuring the public health and I would hope that they would share that view. I mean, I have no reason to think why they wouldn't and that's why it's important. We need to have the information and we need to have the transparency. Public health trumps everything else. That's incredibly important. We believe that as Australians, we would, of course, share this information, as you would expect us to do. I think that's an obligation on all countries.

MURRAY: President Trump has paused immigration to the United States for the next 60 days, one exception is going to be the agricultural sector to make sure that they can continue to work. Have we done the same in Australia?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, we've already cut the permanent immigration rate back to 160,000, we've put a cap on that. We'd done that before we went in to the COVID crisis. And then on top of that, I mean, obviously people can't come here, whether on those temporary work visas and all of those other arrangements, if they're backpackers here, if they've got work and particularly in the ag sectors where they're needed, or they’re health workers or things like that, well fine. But otherwise, I've been fairly clear that it's time to make your way home in those areas and obviously permanent migration requires a lot of health checks and tests that just aren’t happening. So practically we're effectively in the same position.

MURRAY: Now, I know it feels like there are 25 million kids in the back of the car saying are we there yet, are we there yet?

PRIME MINISTER:  It's a bit like that.

MURRAY: But I wanted to ask you, on the way into this, the health advice was clearly the predominant advice that was needed to make decisions. We’re now, seeing a light at the end of the tunnel, who knows how long that is, but are we starting to move now that the information that is going into National Cabinet is more about the economic advice, more about the recovery, than the health advice?

PRIME MINISTER: What I'd say, Paul, is it was always about the economic advice and the health advice. That has always been my approach. Not at any stage were we not conscious of the economic issues that were at stake here and that's why we were so careful and we were so cautious. And so we were getting both sets of advice all the time and we will continue to do that because you go about this on those two fronts. I remember I was being criticised early on for putting too much emphasis on the economic issues and that apparently we shouldn't be considering the economic issues in the same context. I disagreed with that view. I said we had to fight this on both fronts and we continue to and the frustration and what makes this challenge so difficult is that sometimes, oftentimes, the economic measures you take can threaten the health outcomes and vice versa. So that's why, you know, I don't want to keep a restriction in place a second longer than we have to. And in encouraging states to take a similar view, we want to be able to get our economies back up and operating safely in a COVID safe environment, which means that the economy can support people's incomes. I mean, we've processed and this is a, look, it's a great compliment to the people over at government services at Centrelink that they've been able to achieve this. But it breaks my heart that I've had to. We’ve had 550,000 people, Paul, that we've processed for JobSeeker claims in the last five or six weeks. The fact that is that is what we do in a year. And so, amazing work by those public officials who have been over there burning the midnight oil to get this done. It's been a Herculean effort, but it breaks my heart that half a million Australians and there'll be much more too that will be going on and seeking that income support through the JobSeeker program. As you know, about, almost six million, over five million Australians will be getting support through JobKeeper. I want the economy to support people's incomes, not welfare, and now there will always, sadly, be those who will need that support through our social safety net. And I've heard you say many times on your program, we should be proud of the fact that we're a country that has a comprehensive social safety net. We should be very proud of that and that is made possible by having a strong economy and I want to ensure that we get back to that position as quickly as possible. So it's the economy that has people in jobs, that means people could open their businesses again. I want to see kids back at school and people back at work and we want that to happen as soon as that can happen, because that's how this show should be run.

MURRAY: So, obviously the people watching right now, they see about 3,000 cases of COVID, 97 per cent mild, fewer than 50 people in ICU, it is now very close to 40 right now. But the numbers that you just said, about those hundreds of thousands of people who have lost a job, if there are two people arguing on a table, at one point, the 500,000 has to take precedence, doesn’t it?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, let's just understand and remind ourselves of what's happened in other places. Look what's happened in Singapore. Everyone thought Singapore had it under control but now they have more cases than we do. This thing can move like rapid fire. It writes its own rules. We don't get to tell it what to do. We have to be able to manage it and stay on top of it. That's why I'm saying three things we need to do in order to be able to get back to where we want to be. We need to have more comprehensive testing and that is happening. We are making good progress on that. We have one of the most sophisticated and comprehensive testing programs of anywhere in the world. Secondly, we've got to industrialise how we do this contact tracing and soon we will be launching that app, which will help all Australians keep themselves safe and keep their community safe and help us get our economy back where it needs to get to. And we put in all the protections. No Commonwealth Government department agency, no one, me, nobody, can get access to that information. Locked in an encrypted data store. The only person that can access the information will be the public health officer in a state health department that is ringing the person who has coronavirus and they're asked to unlock the data, which means they can contact the people they've been in contact with to help save them and others around them. That's what it does. It's a public health initiative. That's what it is and that's why it's so necessary. And the third thing is what we've seen, particularly most recently in north west Tasmania but in other places, where you will get outbreaks and when you open up your economy again, yes, we'll get outbreaks and we will get more cases. And that means that we just have to be careful about how we stay on top of that and we don't allow it to run away from us. So not easy. But that's where we want to go, that's where we are going to go, and as successful as we've been on the way in, I intend to be as successful on the way out.

MURRAY: Could be three weeks, could be three months, what is the restriction that you are most looking forward to standing at the podium and saying Australia, we are lifting. Is it funerals, is it weddings, is it that backyard barbeque?

PRIME MINISTER: All of the above, but the thing I'm most keen on to see happening as quickly as possible is I want to see kids back in school. I want to see kids back at school and I think when we can achieve that and go into classrooms and learning again, that is something I'm very much looking forward to and we're making a lot of progress towards that. It was great to make the announcement yesterday that we're opening up elective surgery again, this is happening now. I mean, when I was asked about have we reached a turning point, you know, was there going to be a turning point in the future? We've already reached it. We're already on the way back and more and more things will be rolled out in the weeks and months ahead and we've got to where we are quicker than we thought we would and I'm hoping we're able to get to where we want to be quicker than we might have originally estimated. But we've got to take that day by day and we can't get impatient about it. Impatience on these things could lead to an even worse situation, which would mean you'd have to lock down again, and if you had to do that, then the economic pain would be worse, and that's what I'm also trying to avoid. You know, in so many areas, I think I mentioned this to you last time we spoke, you know, one of the great successes, I think, of government has been the way that we've been able to deter terrorist attacks in this country and often cases it's the amazing work that our people do in counterterrorism that people never know about. You don't know what was stopped. And the same is true here. Look overseas. Look at the absolute devastation that has been occurring in other places. That, to date, has not happened here and so let's make sure that remains the case by being patient, by being applied, by being disciplined as we have been. I'm so keen to get us back to a place where our economy is supporting Australians again. That's where we want to be. That's who we want to be.

MURRAY: Ok, three last questions, speed round time. The National Cabinet has been such a wonderful success, I know you want to keep it around for a little while longer because if nothing else, the familiarity, the interaction, all really important, right? For all of the things that you want to do, like the economic surge where it is business at the heart of things, not government, is that process going to inform us? The cooperation, do you think we’re going to be able to keep that up when a form of politics goes back to normal when it is team red, team blue again?

PRIME MINISTER: I certainly hope so. I think it's important that we, as we get to that recovery phase and we prepare for that as we work towards the Budget later this year. I mean, there are many things we can do at the federal level, but there are many, many things that can be done at a state and territory level as well. And I know they want to see their economies bounce back as well and so I would hope that we'd be able to keep that going to get some real consistency and consensus and and cooperation on these important economic changes that will be necessary to see our economy not only get back to where we were, but to go beyond that. And I would hope that we could achieve that. I'm certainly keen to try and lead that type of process and I very much appreciate the great cooperation I've had from those Premiers and Chief Ministers. It's been genuine. It's been very consultative and we've got a lot done. But there's so much more to do.

MURRAY: Now, the strategic oil reserve, because the price is so low we’ve got an opportunity now to stock it up. A lot of people watching this program care very deeply about that. How much are we going to be improving that in the next little while?

PRIME MINISTER: $100 million bucks, 2 million barrels. That's what we announced today and we'll be using the strategic reserve in the United States to achieve that. That's where the storage capacity is. We’re also looking at how we can expand our storage capabilities here as well. That's something Angus is working on as we speak. But that's where that capacity exists right now and that's where we can take advantage of where those prices are right now and we will be looking to boost that in the weeks ahead. So that's an important initiative and there are a lot of things that aren't great. Too many to mention when it comes to this COVID crisis. But building up those reserves while we have that opportunity is a good plan.

MURRAY: I have to ask, are you going to read Turnbull’s book?

PRIME MINISTER: No.

MURRAY: So that gets me to the last question, which is...

PRIME MINISTER: Too much else to do, mate, too much else to do.

MURRAY: Too busy, don’t care, I get it. Perfect answer, perfect answer. Alright, last one here. What are you most looking forward to? The NRL coming back and being able to watch the Sharks play the Tigers or a full Parliament Question Time?

PRIME MINISTER: That's the easiest question I think I've ever had and I would say we will take that one over the Tigers by at least 12 mate. And I hope we can be watching it together. That day when we can all go back to that sort of thing is, I think, really important and we've got to get back to there. There have been so many hard things. You know, you asked me before, I mean, I had young people, young kids who can't see their grandparents and vice versa. But one that really tears me up, though, is how many people have had to deal with loved ones who passed away and to go through funerals with so few people. That is just, it’s just horrible. And so we need… let's look forward to the good days, mate. They’re going to come. They’re going to come.

MURRAY: Bloody oath. Well this is the thing, people want to be able to honour their family as you were able to honour your father, as so many people want to honour. And just, look, thank you for your time tonight, thank you for your leadership, I don’t care who is listening I think you’ve led a global standard mate, well done.

PRIME MINISTER: Good on you. Thanks Paul. All the best.

https://pmtranscripts.pmc.gov.au/release/transcript-42791

Update on Coronavirus Measures

21 April 2020

The National Cabinet met today to take further decisions to save lives, and to save livelihoods.

The Chief Medical Officer Dr Brendan Murphy provided an update on the measures underway, the latest data and medical advice in relation to COVID-19.

There are more than 6,600 confirmed cases in Australia and sadly 71 people have died.

Australia will continue to progress a successful suppression/elimination strategy for the virus. National Cabinet noted data that confirms the measures put in place to suppress the virus have largely been successful in slowing and reversing the growth of cases in Australia, to ensure our health system has the capability to manage the epidemic.

It is estimated that overall, Australia is currently detecting approximately 92 per cent of all symptomatic cases, with each state and territory individually detecting at least 80 per cent. Australia’s point estimate when compared with other countries is 84 per cent, the highest reported detection rate globally.

For COVID-19 suppression strategies to be effective, Reff  (the number of people a single case infects on average) needs to be less than 1.0. The results continue to look very encouraging.

To continue to suppress COVID-19, National Cabinet has commenced further work on Australia’s public health response including enhanced testing, tracing and local health response capabilities. This work will feed into National Cabinet’s review of baseline restrictions by 14 May 2020.

National Cabinet was briefed on the new app currently under development to support state and territory health authorities to notify close contacts of a person diagnosed with COVID-19. National Cabinet provided its in-principle support for the app. The Government will provide further information on the app closer to its release.

National Cabinet agreed to meet again on Friday 24 April 2020.

Elective surgery

National Cabinet received up-to-date data on the stock of personnel protective equipment (PPE) in the National Medical Stockpile, and PPE held by state and territory health systems. PPE stocks and other equipment such as ventilators are now largely sufficient to meet expected demand for Australia’s COVID19 response through to December 2020, with current social distancing and travel restriction measures in place. 

National Cabinet noted that the National Medical Stockpile does not replace state, territory or private processes to source and deliver PPE to meet their needs. To date, the National Medical Stockpile has dispatched over 22 million masks primarily to state and territories, GP’s, Community Pharmacy, ACHHOS and aged care, with a further 11.5 million being dispatched this week.

Unnecessarily delaying elective surgeries can worsen health outcomes, increase anxiety and reduce social and economic productivity. 

As result of Australia’s success in flattening the curve, our low rates of COVID related hospitalisation and new data on stocks of PPE, National Cabinet agreed that from 27 April 2020, category 2 and some important category 3 procedures can recommence across the public and private hospital sectors. 

National Cabinet further agreed that the following procedures can recommence from 27 April 2020:

• IVF

• Screening programs (cancer and other diseases)

• Post cancer reconstruction procedures (such as breast reconstruction)

• Procedures for children under 18 years of age.

• Joint replacements (incl knees, hips, shoulders)

• Cataracts and eye procedures

• Endoscopy and colonoscopy procedures

PPE stocks for these elective surgeries and procedures will not be taken from the National Medical Stockpile.

It is estimated that a gradual restart of elective surgeries will see 1 in 4 closed elective surgery operating lists reopen, with flexibility for states to determine the appropriate levels of elective surgery within this general framework.

Reintroduction of elective surgery in a staged manner balances the ongoing need for the capacity to treat COVID-19 patients, while allowing our hospitals to treat elective surgery patients.

These arrangements will be reviewed by 11 May 2020, to determine if other elective surgeries and procedures can recommence and volumes increased.

National Cabinet further agreed to the Australian Dental Association recommendation that dentists move to level 2 restrictions (such as fitting dentures, braces, non-high speed drill fillings and basic fillings), allowing a broader range of dental interventions to occur where the risk of transmission can be managed and PPE stocks procured by the private sector.

National Cabinet again thanked Australia’s health care professionals for their work to support our COVID-19 response.

Aged Care Response

National Cabinet discussed the lessons learned from recent COVID-19 outbreaks in residential aged care facilities and acknowledged the critical importance of adequate infection prevention and control measures in minimising the spread of COVID-19.

It is not acceptable, fair or compassionate for any residential aged care facilities to ban visits from carers and families.

National Cabinet reconfirmed the principles announced on 18 March 2020 regarding visits to aged care facilities. In line with these principles, visits should be limited to a short duration, a maximum of two visitors at one time per day, and conducted in line with social distancing practices. This is designed to limit the spread of COVID-19 in residential aged care facilities.

Infection prevention and control measures must be balanced against the needs and best interests of residents. Aged care providers are best placed to make these assessments on a case by case basis.

National Cabinet also reiterated that the following visitors and staff (including visiting workers) should not be permitted to enter the aged care facilities:

• Those who have returned from overseas in the last 14 days;

• Those who have been in contact with a confirmed case of COVID-19 in the last 14 days;

• Those with fever or any (even mild) symptoms of acute respiratory infection (e.g. cough, sore throat, runny nose, shortness of breath); and

• Those who have not been vaccinated against influenza (after 1 May).

All Governments are committed to protecting and supporting elderly and vulnerable Australians and are working together, with aged care providers, to manage infection control. This extends to supporting health and aged care workers to be safe and healthy while at work, including appropriate use of PPE and screening of staff.

Family members who may be concerned about the care being provided to loved ones in residential aged care facilities are encouraged to contact the Aged Care Quality and Safety Commission.

Schools

National Cabinet re-emphasised that the one person per four square metres rule does not apply in school classrooms. Schools should consult the most recent AHPPC advice, issued on 16 April 2020.

https://pmtranscripts.pmc.gov.au/release/transcript-43978

Honour the Service and Sacrifice at Home for ANZAC Day

19 April 2020

Prime Minister, Minister for Veterans and Defence Personnel

Australians are being encouraged to honour the service and sacrifice of our veterans and serving Defence personnel on ANZAC Day from home this year by watching the nationally broadcast Dawn Service from the Australian War Memorial and participating in the RSL’s #lightupthedawn campaign.

Prime Minister Scott Morrison said while ANZAC Day will be different this year, with no community commemorative services or marches, we will be doing all we can to honour and commemorate the sacrifice of our Anzacs and thank all those who have served and continue to serve Australia in our defence forces.

“ANZAC day is a sacred day for all Australians. It is an important time to remember the sacrifices of those who have gone before us, those who have laid down their lives or suffered great hardship to protect Australians’ way of life,” the Prime Minister said.

“This year, we will not be gathering at the local cenotaph, or attending gunfire breakfasts at the local RSL, or gathering together to bow our heads in silence and listen to the bugles at dawn.

“But we will still remember the sacrifice of those who gave so much for us at Gallipoli and on many fronts, as we ourselves give what we can to protect Australian lives while we face this terrible virus.”

This year, a Dawn Service will be broadcast across Australia from the Australian War Memorial.

The Australian Wall Memorial is the home of the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier as well as the Roll of Honour which contains the names of the 102,000 servicemen and women who have given their lives for Australia.

In keeping with the national commitment to social distancing, this will be a service without crowds.

The Prime Minister will deliver the commemorative address at the Australian War Memorial’s Dawn Service alongside dignitaries representing Australia, New Zealand, the Returned and Services League, and veterans.

There will be a ceremonial piper, didgeridoo player and bugler among other traditional elements, supplied by the Australian Defence Force.

RSL State and Territory branches are also urging Australians to show their Anzac spirit at home by safely participating in a private dawn service at their own home.

The RSL’s #lightupthedawn campaign year asks Australians to stand in their driveway, balcony or living room, with a torch or candle, immediately following in the televised dawn service, to remember all those who have served and sacrificed.

Minister for Veterans’ Affairs and Defence Personnel Darren Chester said Australians are at their best when they come together to support one another and while we cannot physically gather to commemorate the service and sacrifice of our Defence personnel, we can show them our respect.

“Whether it’s a solitary driveway tribute, baking Anzac biscuits, a small ceremony with your household, sharing a message for our service personnel, or watching the televised service from the Australian War Memorial on the morning of 25 April, I encourage everyone to pause, reflect and say a simple ‘thank you for your service’,” Mr Chester said.

“We should think about all those who have served and died during their service in the Australian Defence Force, we should think about those who continue to serve in uniform today and we should think about those who love and support them in their service.”

The coverage of the commemorative service will take place at the Australian War Memorial on Anzac Day, 25 April 2020, with the ABC starting pre-service coverage from 5am AEST, with the service broadcast live from the Commemorative Area and Hall of Memory from 5.30am AEST.

The event will not be open to the public but will be broadcast live across Australia and streamed online. The ABC will make the broadcast available to other networks under a host broadcaster arrangement to enable people to mark Anzac Day safely and respectfully from home.

https://pmtranscripts.pmc.gov.au/release/transcript-42789

Interview with Alan Jones, 2GB

17 April 2020

ALAN JONES: On the line from Canberra, I hope he’s had a sleep, Prime Minister, good morning.

PRIME MINISTER: Yes. I have Alan. I'm feeling very fresh.

JONES: Well, I just want to thank you on behalf of people who want to thank you for the work you and Greg Hunt and Josh Frydenberg. People mightn’t agree with everything, but by God, you've worked night and day. We're very grateful for that. Mind you, mind you, I'm not sure that, I'm not sure that I really should be talking to you, because I understand from a member of the Liberal Party that you are always white-anting people and you're a troublemaking treasurer and you're trying to, shouldn’t have won the election either, I think he said, shouldn't have won the election. There's a book. I'm told the book is somewhere in the toilet section in the supermarkets. There might be a reason for all of that. Can you handle all this?

PRIME MINISTER: I think I'll just let that go through to the keeper, Alan. I’ve got other things to focus on.

JONES: You're absolutely right. You're absolutely right. Look, at the National Cabinet meeting yesterday. 374,500 tests, 6,400 confirmed cases. So 1.7 per cent of all tests turned into a positive outcome. The number of deaths, every death diminishes, as you say that, I say that, 0.016 of all tests completed. Out there they're saying, the public is saying to you, look, and the polls today, they do support what you've done. At what point do we change direction and just open the door a bit? A bit?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, two things. First of all, as the National Cabinet agreed yesterday that where states and territories have gone beyond in their own judgement, what were the baseline sort of levels of restrictions that will be put in place, and some states and territories went further than that. They'll be looking at those over the next few weeks, over the next month. In four weeks from now, the National Cabinet is going to look at those formal baseline restrictions we put in place. So there were a lot of businesses and these sorts of things and restrictions around those, and they're going to be looking at those at that time. But there are three things that have to happen first to enable those considerations in four weeks’ time to be successful. First of all, we've got to broaden the testing even further than it is now. It's called sentinel testing, it’s also surveillance testing and it's a much broader range of testing. So we can find out more quickly where there are hotspots that we need to go and address. Secondly, we need to get an automatic industrial level tracing of the coronavirus. Now, we've just seen one of the reasons why we need that down in north west Tasmania, you might have heard those reports. There was someone, they had coronavirus, they didn't tell the truth to the health authorities who were seeking to trace that and they've put many people at risk. Now, we've been working on this automatic process through an app that can ensure that we can know where the contacts were over that infection period and we can move very quickly to lock that down. 

JONES: The Tasmanian Government did that well, didn't they? They were quarantining everybody, locked the whole show down, it was a good response.

PRIME MINISTER: Yeah and they’re going even further now. I was speaking to Peter Gutwein last night. I mean, as you know, premiers and I, we're talking all the time when these issues come up. And it's a big challenge for them down there and he's doing a great job. So we've got to get that in place. And the third thing, Alan, is we sort of need like a flying squad, sort of SWAT team sort of approach that where there is an outbreak in a particular area and wherever that might be, let's say it's in Sefton or something like that, that you can move in quickly and put in measures in place which can stop the spread in that particular community. A lot like what Peter Gutwein is doing now in north west Tasmania. Now, if we can get those three things in place, it means we've got the protections there to actually start to ease some of these restrictions. If we don't do that, we would be rushing to failure. And if we fail now, we could put ourselves in an even worse position than when we started.

JONES: You're being very diplomatic. They weren't your restrictions. In fact, you didn't recommend this stuff. There are some rogue premiers here in relation to schooling, in relation to lockdowns. And that's angered many people, not you and Frydenberg and Hunt, but it's angered a lot of people. I mean, what they want to know is what is the sign of success that you're looking for before the stay at home laws can be eased and indeed, if you find those signs, what's to say the states are going to step in alone?

PRIME MINISTER: I'm very confident that the National Cabinet is working together. And it is true, Alan, there are some states and territories that went further than the agreed baselines. That was allowable under the discussion that we had and I'm working closely with all the premiers and chief ministers. So I'm not going to make criticisms.

JONES: But Daniel Andrews says kids stay at home and Annastacia Palaszczuk says to the kids stay at home. Gladys is not sure whether they should stay at home or go to school. 

PRIME MINISTER: Well, yesterday... let me come back to that in one second. But you asked me…

JONES: What is your sign of success?

PRIME MINISTER: Yep. The key measure isn't just seeing that the curve flatten on the rate of growth of cases, particularly for local transmission. It's what's called, it's this number that looks at how one person, when there's one case, how many people are transferred to another. Now, when that number is less than one, and it is below one now in all states and territories except for Tasmania, if we can hold that number consistently under one, then that means that the virus is going down, not up. Now, if we can do that, then we can get these protections in place. That means we can move back towards the sort of economy we want. We can have kids being taught in classrooms, and there's no reason why kids can't be taught in classrooms on the health advice. There are clear issues you've got to address for teachers, as teachers are more likely... teachers are more at risk in the staff room than the classroom. That's what the health advice says. So we've got to get those arrangements right and I think the states will be moving in the right direction there. We agreed on a set of principles yesterday amongst all of us, which said the best place for a child to get an education is in the classroom in front of a professional teacher. And that is the gold standard that we need to move back towards and it will take more time to get there for some than others. In the Northern Territory, they'll be there on Monday. They'll be doing that on Monday.

JONES: Yes. I mean, you've got to look, you've got this job of looking at the now and the tomorrow. And I'm sure you're getting heaps of correspondence and so am I that where these restrictions have cost hundreds of thousands…

PRIME MINISTER: [Inaudible]

JONES: Well, like I stay up answering the damn things, I can tell you. But hundreds of thousands of Australians have lost their jobs, their savings, their lifestyle.

PRIME MINISTER: True.

JONES: And it's difficult to know if they'll get any of them back.

PRIME MINISTER: Well, that is certainly our objective, and that's why the JobKeeper program was put in place. Some 6 million Australians are estimated will keep connected to their jobs. The work we've sought to do with tenants so that they don’t get kicked out of their tenancies, to ensure that the banks are doing the right thing…

JONES: Sorry to interrupt you there, but you know what's going on in Queensland I take it? I mean, you can't be across everything here. But in Queensland, there are these unbelievably draconian laws which are going to be passed by the Parliament, I understand, where the landlord can't inspect his property, the landlord can't ever retrieve rent. Any rent forgone has to be foregone forever, where the landlord can't evict. We know that. So therefore, the tenancy can be increased. I mean, these are unbelievably draconian provisions and this is what I'm saying, is you’ve got these rogue states and people are suffering badly. 

PRIME MINISTER: Well, people deal with their states, there’s no doubt about that. What we agreed on commercial tenancies as a country with all the states and territories, the code was very clear about this, that there should be a proportional reduction in rent to reflect the reduction in trade. And that reduction, half of it, should be in a waiver. So that means forgone. And the other half would be in deferral.

JONES: But, Prime Minister, in Queensland this stuff is going to be introduced to the Parliament in Queensland. Tenants will not have to pay back any rent. Landlords can't ask a tenant for proof of financial hardship, but tenants can request a rent reduction without proof. Landlord insurance won't cover you for rent in arrears. The tenancy will automatically be extended for six months if it expires during the six month freeze on evictions because there's a moratorium on evictions so the landlord could go for 12 months without any rent. Tenants can refuse entry to the owner for anything apart from emergency repairs. They don't have to participate in inspections. Someone wants to buy the property, they can't show the prospective owner. I mean, where's this coming from?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, the Commercial Tenancies Code agreed at National Cabinet should be the guide for the legislation.

JONES: Yes, I know, but it's not.

PRIME MINISTER: That's what the benchmark should be. That's what everybody agreed to do and that's what I would suggest should be the standard. But what the whole point behind that, though, Alan, was this is. And remember, you raised one of these issues with me, I think it was on air.

JONES: Yep.

PRIME MINISTER: What we wanted is landlords and tenants just to sit down and work it out and do it in a sensible way. And there were landlords who were, frankly, being terribly unreasonable to tenants, as you told me.

JONES: Yep.

PRIME MINISTER: But equally, that the code puts obligations on tenants too to turn up at the table. And the key, the test for whether someone should be covered by these arrangements is that they are on the JobKeeper program.

JONES: I know.

PRIME MINISTER: If you're on the JobKeeper, that is the evidence that you should be able to access these arrangements.

JONES: But, you know, you issue a national... I read that press release yesterday and the National Cabinet, all the premiers are there. And you didn't, it wasn't Scott Morrison. It was this outfit that advises you, the Australian Health Protection Principal Committee and the press release said, ‘On current evidence, schools can remain fully open.’

PRIME MINISTER: That's right.

JONES: Now, Annastacia Palaszczuk and Daniel Andrews and Gladys to some extent walk out of the room and they don't abide by any of that. This is what's getting people out there.

PRIME MINISTER: What I think you'll see on schools over the next month, and Gladys was making this point yesterday, I think very helpfully, and I wouldn't be surprised to see something go similarly up in Queensland ultimately as well. It’s already there in the Northern Territory and South Australia, they have 50 per cent school attendance going into the break, and I know Premier Marshall is very keen to see that improved on when they go back. Western Australia, I think you'll see some…

JONES: Yeah, I think South Australia and Western Australia are doing a good job on this.

PRIME MINISTER: They’re doing a fantastic job and Tasmania, I think they'll do the same. So, look, you know, the federation is working better than it's ever worked. But you know, we'll keep trying to work towards those standards and I'll keep seeking to set them and say we're getting a level of cooperation that I don't think we've ever seen before.

JONES: But what the other thing I’m saying is, at this point now you're getting health advice, health advice, health advice. Have we reached the point where we need to get some economic advice and some social advice?

PRIME MINISTER: All the time. We had Dr. Stephen Kennedy, who is the Secretary of Treasury, Phil Lowe, Governor of the Reserve Bank, and they were back again at National Cabinet yesterday. That was the first hour of the meeting yesterday was on the economics and that is occurring regularly. So we're drawing advice from them. We're also drawing advice from Nev Power and that coordination commission, which has, you know, some fantastic business people on there. David Thodey, Catherine Tanner, a bunch are in there to ensure that we're getting that private sector industry advice coming through of the decisions being made by our Cabinet federally and in the National Cabinet. So I've always said, Alan, it’s a war on two fronts.

JONES: Yeah, I know that.

PRIME MINISTER: The impact on people's livelihoods is very significant.

JONES: Right, and just coming to that, PM. David Katz, Professor Katz, the founding director at Yale University says, ‘I'm deeply concerned that the social, economic and public health consequences of this near total meltdown of normal life will be long lasting and calamitous, possibly graver than the direct toll of the virus itself. The unemployment, impoverishment and despair likely to result will be public health scourges of the first order.’

PRIME MINISTER: Well, look, we've got to balance that view with them digging mass graves in New York, Alan, and that's real and we're not immune from that. It can happen here. That can happen here and any Australian who does not think that we cannot see what's happening in other parts of the world happening here is kidding themselves. And so we need to protect against that. That's why those three things I've set out and need to be put in place. I don't want to have a restriction in place for a day longer than it needs to be. I want the economy to come back to a level of activity, which means people don't need welfare, that they don't need JobKeeper. And if the economy can start supporting them again, I want to see businesses at the centre of the economy, not government, I want businesses at the centre of it and businesses at the centre on the other side as well.

JONES: Good on you.

PRIME MINISTER: The idea that somehow we're going to have nationalisation into the future and government subsidies forever and this is a watershed change in how Australia operates, that's nonsense. We've got an emergency response now and governments have to do that.

JONES: That's right. But you've got to get to the Parliament. You've got Labor and the Greens joining up and they'll tell you you're a callous and uncaring person because you're going to unwind all this. Just quickly before we go on JobSeeker. You would have heard the comments from Peter Strong from the Council Small Business Organisations who said up to 20 per cent of employers eligible to employ are considering not applying because of the attitude of employees. He said, ‘These employees are saying, it's my money, you have to give it to me and you can't tell me what to do.’ And he said, well, a lot of employers are saying, well, I'm not going to do it.

PRIME MINISTER: We changed the Fair Work Act, which meant that the employer can make a whole range of instructions to employees.

JONES: That's it.

PRIME MINISTER: And that meant, let’s say you were only on the JobKeeper payment and you can't change someone's wage rate but you can say, well, if there's $1,500 a fortnight, that means you need to work one day a fortnight or three days a fortnight or, you know, a week, five days a fortnight or even a whole fortnight. The employer can do that under the changes to the law that we made.

JONES: But is the employer obligated to give all of the $1,500 to the worker?

PRIME MINISTER: Yes, of course they are.

JONES: All of it. So he might be on $200, so he gets another $750? You might get $200 a week because you're casual.

PRIME MINISTER: Well Alan,  you can only access it from one employer. So many people are with many employers. So that means they may have been working as a casual for many employers. They can only get it from one.

JONES: No, no, I’ve got to say, just say I’ve got a casual working for me. He meets the criteria, been with me for twelve months, but he only does five or six hours a week. He gets about $200 a week. Do I then, am either obligated, to keep him and give him another $750? 

PRIME MINISTER: Well, you're not obligated to keep him.

JONES: I know, but if I keep him.

PRIME MINISTER: If you decide to keep him…

JONES: He gets $200 and another $750.

PRIME MINISTER: It averages out over the entire workforce and this a complicated system. You're trying to get the six million people. And that means there are some things that we've had to do which are not ideal, but that means it works for everybody.

JONES: Come on. You're not normally evasive. Does he get my $200 and your $750? Does he get $950?

PRIME MINISTER: No, no, no, no. They get $750 a week.

JONES: And my $200's. I'm already paying him $200.

PRIME MINISTER: Well, you don't have to pay him $200.

JONES: So gets three times more than he's already getting.

PRIME MINISTER: The max you can get is $750 a week. That's the max you can get.

JONES: I know, three times more than he's getting already. Ok, I’ll let you go. Thank you so much. We'll talk again next week. Have a good weekend, if that's possible.

PRIME MINISTER: Thanks a lot, Alan, good to talk to you and thank you to your listeners for their support. I appreciate it very much, all of the team does.

https://pmtranscripts.pmc.gov.au/release/transcript-42788

Interview with Studio 10

17 April 2020

SARAH HARRIS: The Prime Minister joins us live from Canberra. Good morning. Prime Minister, thanks for your company. Did you ever doubt your strategy? You were under a lot of pressure from some parts of the medical community to go hard and to go early. But you stood your ground. Are you glad you did?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, I think we have been taking the right approach. And what's really been focussing our efforts is we've got to have the right answers for Australia. You just can't go and carbon copy what they're doing in other places. You got to think about your own community, the risks that we have here, take advantage of the things that we have, and being an island is a pretty big one of that with strong border protection. So we've been working through our strengths and I think we've also tried to be as respectful as we can of the, you know, the way we live in Australia. And so I think we've got the balance right so far. But we can't get complacent. We've got to keep this focus going. And I've been adamant from the start that, yes, there's a massive health challenge here, but there's also a massive economic one. We've got to save lives and livelihoods and we've got to deal with these two things together. And that's what we're endeavouring to do with programs like JobKeeper. But as well, what we're doing on the health front, where with Australians great help - and thanks again, Australia, for the wonderful support and patience that you're showing I know it's tough, but hang in there, we're getting through it.

ANGELA BISHOP: Yeah. Prime Minister, what's the end game given the damage that this is doing to our economy? Are we still trying to flatten the curve or eliminate the virus altogether?

PRIME MINISTER: It's about flattening. And yesterday we talked about a new measure that we're using, which is about if someone gets the coronavirus, how many people they can transfer it onto. And now if when we keep that below 1 and that's where we are right now in all states except for Tasmania, we keep that there for a period of time, then we increase our confidence. And that means over the next four weeks we’ll then be able to look at easing some of these restrictions that we have in place. And we want to do that because we want to get the economic activity going up again and we want the economy being able to support people's incomes, supporting their jobs without the need for JobKeeper and JobSeeker. I mean, they'll be there for six months. But the more the economy can carry the weight of people's incomes and that's better for everyone.

JOE HILDEBRAND: And PM I think you and the Premiers have done an exceptional job. And so I don't want to have a go at all. But it is quite obvious that there is a difference between the federal Chief Medical Officer’s advice and that of some of the states, particularly Victoria. Is it, is it not the case that the states have kind of run away from the federal approach a bit and seem to be going towards harder lockdown, perhaps towards more of a containment strategy rather than flatten the curve strategy? And does that mean that the National Cabinet model is broken, that it's not working because the states aren't really doing what the federal government wants to do? In some cases, they're playing their own game, aren't they?

PRIME MINISTER: No, I don't think that's true, Joe. I don't think that's true at all. I mean, the National Cabinet works because it respects the fact that all states and territories are sovereign in their own governments, as indeed the federal government is. And what we do is we set a series of baselines on what those restrictions should be. And in some cases, states and territories, which is their absolute right, have decided to go further in some cases. And that's been in relation to specific restrictions like golf courses in Victoria, you can play golf in New South Wales, or it's been in the liquor restriction in Western Australia or it's been in the degree of enforcement. Now in South Australia, the hard legal enforcement only applies at 10, the strong public advice is 2 people. But in New South Wales and Victoria, then, they’re enforcement. But you know, the virus is operating differently in the states. It's you can't assume that it's the same in every place. I mean, it's like average rainfall across the nation, it means absolutely nothing. You've got to look at it, I mean, we've got to deal with this at a high level, but the states have got to deal with it on the ground. So we're respecting those differences, and even on issues like schools where I know there's been some you know, there's been the perception of even greater disagreement, that actually isn't really true. We all want the same thing. And we said this yesterday - ultimately the best place for kids to be is in a classroom learning from a professional teacher. And there's been no dispute about the health advice right across the board that children are safe to go to school. I think confusion has come because of the safety and the issues relating to teachers and teachers are more at risk in the staff room than they are in the classroom. And I think we're getting that message across now, but each state and territory will do things a little bit differently, and that's okay.

HILDEBRAND: So I understand that. I'm certainly not disputing the difficulties in managing all the political problems as well as the health ones. But what happens when the federal Chief Medical Officer says in the National Cabinet, schools are safe and the Victorian Chief Medical Officer says no they're not, we’re going to shut them down anyway?

PRIME MINISTER: But that's not what they’re saying. So that's mischaracterising what he's actually saying, there is a consensus that of the health advice, amongst the medical expert panel that schools are safe for children and not, the Victorian Chief Health Officer has said anything different than that.

MERRICK WATTS: Prime Minister, Merrick Watts here. Obviously, your family's in isolation like everybody else's families. How are they coping in the moment? And has your family run out of puzzles?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, they haven't finished them yet. I know that much. There's a puzzle sitting on the dining room table, which is, the corners are in, though. I'm very impressed with that - but I think that's more Jenny’s doing than anyone else's today. Today, Jenny tells me, because they are on their school holidays now and they're working doing, they're making a garden. They're doing a veggie garden today. That's their activity for the day. Jenny - she should write a book on this. I mean, mums are amazing in terms of how they keep kids entertained and focussed on all parents who are doing that job at the moment, good on you. I mean, people think I've got a hard job. I'm not looking after two kids at home and keeping them focussed, and apart from each other for most of the time. I got a wonderful, well it was sent to me actually by a very senior journalist. And she showed me the picture of what it looks like 5 per cent of the time, two kids sitting down doing their homework on the table. What it looks like 95 per cent of the time, and the two kids are at each other's throats. So, hats off to the parents keeping their kids applied.

HARRIS: I reckon it's a line ball between you and Jenny who has the harder job at the moment. You have been splashing a lot of cash to put off what many are describing as the next Great Depression. In fact, the boys from the Betoota Advocate have called your approach “Scocialism” which I thought was brilliant. What happens at the end of this six months, though? Will the money run out?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, we've been very clear that the lifeline that we could put in place is finite. And that's why it's an important edge, that we actually build up the economy over that period of time and that we are in a position to be able to wind back some of these restrictions so the economy can lift and start supporting people without the need for what these emergency measures are. And I disagree with the guys at Betoota, that wouldn’t be the first time. But this isn't about socialism. That’s not what it is. It's an emergency now. And we need these emergency measures, on the other side of this we're going to need things that actually grow businesses, get regulation out of the way, make sure that businesses can employ people again and get on with their investments. And that's what we're going to need and we're very focussed on that as well. But right now, the three things we need to do in order to start easing these restrictions in about four weeks from now. First one is we've got to have more testing. We've got the best testing regime in the world or if not the best, pretty close to it. We'll make the finals I can assure you of that. The second one is that we need to expand the automation using technology of how we trace the contacts of those being affected by the coronavirus. And the third is you sort of need a flying squad, you know, a SWAT team, if you like, on how you're cracking down on outbreaks where they occur. We're seeing a bit of that in North West Tasmania at the moment. So we've got to build up our strength in those three things. That means that we can ease restrictions four weeks from now and can be confident that when there are outbreaks, we can pick them, respond to them fast and keep that that figure I was talking about, that's called the Reff, or the technical term. But if that's below 1, then then we're winning and if we're not, if it's above 1, then we're going to have to work harder. 

BISHOP: We've all learned so many new technical terms during this time. I'll tell you what. Now, I've got to ask, how do you feel about Malcolm Turnbull releasing his memoir, attacking you in the middle of this crisis?

PRIME MINISTER: Not interested.

BISHOP: Not even, he released a personal message that you'd given him? You know, there's a lot of stuff in there when, the when the nation really is focussed on other stuff?

PRIME MINISTER: Yeah I don’t care.

HARRIS: Prime Minister it’s your birthday next month, if someone gave you a copy of the book, 

PRIME MINISTER: Cheers!

HARRIS: Would you regift it? Or would you read it?

PRIME MINISTER: I wouldn't notice it.

HARRIS: Return to sender hey. I think you've made yourself pretty clear on that one.

PRIME MINISTER: I think so.

HILDEBRAND: I understand how you feel.

HARRIS: Prime Minister we know you're extremely busy, man. We will have to leave it there. We really appreciate you taking the time to talk to us today. Oh, before we let you go, we did this terrible segment earlier on during the, during the show. It was so bad.

HARRIS: You thought coronavirus was bad, where we had a dad joke-off and we understand that you've got a cracker that you want to share with us?

PRIME MINISTER: I don’t know about that. But how do you make a handkerchief dance?

HILDEBRAND: I don’t know, how do you make a handkerchief dance?

PRIME MINISTER: You put a bit of boogie in it.

HARRIS: Coronavirus inspired as well. Prime Minister Scott Morrison, we do appreciate your time. Thank you so much for joining us.

PRIME MINISTER: Well thanks, Australia. Thanks for everything you're doing out there. We really appreciate it. Keep going. We'll get through it.

https://pmtranscripts.pmc.gov.au/release/transcript-42787

Interview with Neil Mitchell, 3AW

17 April 2020

NEIL MITCHELL: On the line Prime Minister Scott Morrison, good morning.

PRIME MINISTER: G’day Neil.

MITCHELL: Thanks for your time. First, South Australia says 600,000 masks that the Commonwealth provided are inadequate and have removed them. That right?

PRIME MINISTER: No they are reversing that decision. That was a false alarm. 

MITCHELL: Was it? Because Victoria's got the same masks? 

PRIME MINISTER: Yeah, exactly. It's a false alarm. And the South Australian Health Minister, I understand, will be issuing a statement to that effect very shortly. 

MITCHELL: Okay. Everything's alright with them. You know, how on earth? That’s terrifying, how did that happen?

PRIME MINISTER: Look all I could tell you was that's the advice I've had this morning and look occasionally, Neil, these are extraordinary times, things like this will happen, where they’re corrected quickly, that's good. 

MITCHELL: Okay. Leads me to the matter of supplies, though. China is restricting medical supplies to the United States, which includes masks and testing kits and the rest. Is there any suggestion they'll restrict material to us? 

PRIME MINISTER: Look, no, we've had quite a bit of success here. We've been working commercially. I think that's been one of the really good stories we've had over the last month. I mean, we have around 100 million masks in now with our current orders and what we've got here in April and we've got supply lines going out now over the next sort of 6 months. The Health Minister, Greg Hunt, and with support from, you know, people in the industry as well. I mean, you would have heard that the work that was done through the Minderoo foundation on testing and others, they have been working with a lot of partners to improve and secure those supply lines. And, you know, that's been going pretty well for us, keeping our head down and focussed on our lane.

MITCHELL: I guess the significance, yeah the significance of China restricting supplies to the US at a time like this is pretty ugly, though. And they did, of course, take a lot of stuff out of this country before it hits. Are we getting material from China? 

PRIME MINISTER: Yes. And we have been, and we've been testing its veracity as well before we've been putting it into public use. I mean, when I was in the G20 leaders meeting hook up a few weeks ago, and one of the things we all agreed is that we had to keep essential supply lines open. 

MITCHELL: Also, the acting PM in Britain, the acting British PM says after this thing could be no business as usual with China. We can't have business as usual with China. Do you agree? 

PRIME MINISTER: Well, they're coming from a different position with us. I mean, I mean, we already have, I think, a lot of very tough controls and rules about everything from, and not specific to China necessarily, but I mean, things like foreign interference legislation that we already have, the arrangements that we have under 5G, I mean, these countries aren’t in that position. 

MITCHELL: So it will be business as usual with China?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, look, we've always been vigilant about these things, but at the same time, we’ve continued to pursue a productive, comprehensive strategic partnership with China. But we have an eyes wide open relationship.

MITCHELL: And how much of the medical stuff we're getting in the moment is coming through China?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, a big part of that testing material that we were able to secure working with Twiggy Forrest actually was secured out of China. 

MITCHELL: And we hope they don't impose the same ban on us as the United States?

PRIME MINISTER: There was a big shipment, a very big shipment. But look, you know, you just got to work your supply lines and a lot of these are commercial supply lines and. And so that's holding up. And Greg Hunt, and Nev Power, who heads the COVID Commission, they've been working in well with this as well. So it's an industry, government and private sector effort. 

MITCHELL: Now, I understand the measures you want to put in place before you can ease restrictions like the disease detectives and some sort of tracking app and all and to deal with things that come up quickly because they're going to come up. But what is the metric at which stage you’d look at imposing that? Does it mean no community transmissions, no new cases? What do you need to see before you get those three things in place? What do you need to see before you ease restrictions? 

PRIME MINISTER: Well, it's a thing called the Reff, which is a coefficient. It's a measure which looks at if someone gets it how many people do they then transfer it effectively to after you've put all these restrictions and mitigations in place, in isolation and things like that now where that number is below 1, where it, which is where it is now and every state and territory except for Tasmania, where we've had one of those outbreaks, then if you can keep it there consistently and that's what we're looking at over the next four weeks, if we can keep it there over the next four weeks with the things we've had in place. And we can build up our defences on testing, on tracing and an immediate response capability to lock down on outbreaks in particular areas, then we believe in four weeks we'll be able to ease some of those restrictions that we've had in place.

MITCHELL: So we've got to follow the Reff. have we?

PRIME MINISTER: Yep.

MITCHELL: And if, we get that every day?

PRIME MINISTER: No, it's not easily produced every day. It's something that the Doherty Institute works with our medical expert panel to produce. And it's using a tool, which I mean we're learning a lot of new names and terms in all of this. But there’s a tool called ‘nowcasting’ as opposed to forecasting. And so it models the transmission rate based on all the other data. It's quite a complicated process, but that's what it produces at the end of day for lay people like you and me, it says how many people get it from one person getting it and when that's below 1, then we're winning. 

MITCHELL: So when you do look at easing, does the social distancing ease, you let people out more, but do you still stay a meter and a half away from people those...

PRIME MINISTER: Yes, absolutely. 

MITCHELL: Is that long term?

PRIME MINISTER: Yeah, until there's a vaccine.

MITCHELL: There's no guarantee there'll be a vaccine? We still haven’t got one for SARS?

PRIME MINISTER: Well sure. Remember there was never a vaccine for SARS or MERS and the virus died off effectively, but social distancing is something we should get very used to for the foreseeable future. 

MITCHELL: What, a year?

PRIME MINISTER: Well...

MITCHELL: They say 18 months to a year for a vaccine, that's most optimistic?

PRIME MINISTER: It could be a year Neil. But I mean, I'm not speculating about that. But that is the thing that I think instinctively, certainly while the virus is prevalent across the world, that we’ll that should be a natural instinct for us. 

MITCHELL: Does that also mean that we have to look at keeping the international borders closed for a year? 

PRIME MINISTER: Well, we haven't made any decision on that or in what areas they might be restricted. I think that's at another level beyond what we're going to look at in the next four weeks. I mean, we're still seeing a virus around the world which is rampant. I mean, Australia is at the top of the leaderboard both on our testing, the success of our testing. The way we're flattening the curve, all of this we're doing very well comparatively. And that's because of the efforts and sacrifices that Australians are making. Other countries aren't in that situation. Some are doing better than others, but few are doing as well as Australia. 

MITCHELL: The electronic tracking, that will be optional, not compulsory?

PRIME MINISTER: It will be optional, but we need to get a big take-up. And this is the simple sort of deal we're looking to make and states and territories and the, with the Australian people. If people take-up this app, that means we have greater confidence that if someone gets the coronavirus, we can more quickly trace down their contacts of people who they may have infected. Now, if we can't do that, if we don't have that capacity, then we'll have to keep the restrictions in for longer. 

MITCHELL: But doesn't that metadata exist already through the telcos? Couldn't you get it from them? 

PRIME MINISTER: Well, we believe this should be done on a permission basis by the Australian people and the security arrangements should be there for people’s privacy. 

MITCHELL: So, and if you don't take it, if we don’t take it up in big enough numbers, what did you say 40 per cent?

PRIME MINISTER: 40 per cent is the minimum yeah. 

MITCHELL: If we don't take it up in those numbers, the restrictions stay?

PRIME MINISTER: We'd have to because we wouldn't have the confidence that if there's an outbreak that we'd be able to contain it with an Reff of less than of less than 1.

MITCHELL: There’s that Reff again. Can you tell me, is, all of this is almost a sideline, do you know are any of the private hospitals yet being used for COVID cases?

PRIME MINISTER: Yes, there have been cases where they're being used, particularly when we've had some of these cruise ship cases, in Western Australia we had a particular case with a German cruise ship, that was one of the early on arrangements we've had. And we basically took over a couple of private hospitals for that exact purpose.

MITCHELL: Let's look ahead. The economic pain. Tim Pallas says our grandchildren will be paying for this. I'll be talking to him later. Post pandemic, you're going to have to look at increasing taxes aren’t you?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, we're going to have to look at growing the economy. 

MITCHELL: No, you wouldn't look at increased, increasing taxes?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, increasing taxes doesn't always grow the economy. So we've got to get our economy up and humming. That’s how you get people back into work. And when people are back in work, then they are paying taxes. 

MITCHELL: How do you do that with closed borders? 

PRIME MINISTER: Well, this is why we need to get on top of this and get moving forward on it and getting our domestic economy up first and where we're able to then increase our linkages. And we've already got a freight subsidisation plan at the moment for our exports, we've already put that in place and we're getting our crayfish back out into China now.

MITCHELL: Do you agree with Tim Pallas, that our grandchildren will be paying for this?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, I would hope not. I would hope not in terms of the additional debt burden that we're taking on. But let's not forget that our debt to GDP, our debt as a size of our economy, while it's high by Australian standards, by world standards everyone would rather be us. 

MITCHELL: Do you think we could be looking at a COVID levy, post pandemic? Where sort of, we got to pay some of this, put a levy, a bit of a poll tax on?

PRIME MINISTER: Again, that's not something that we're contemplating. 

MITCHELL: Not yet.

PRIME MINISTER: My first priority on the other side of this is to grow the economy. That's how you actually restore people's livelihoods. That's how you build up your revenues as a government again, you do that by having an economy that's successful and so it would be unwise to do things that would actually retard your growth. And that's why we need a business economy, growing employment friendly policies on the other side of this that will see our economy lift and people will be able to regain their standard of living and to start paying down that debt.

MITCHELL: As the IMF said, could we be looking at depression? And if so, what does it mean to the average person? 

PRIME MINISTER: Well, I'm not speculating about that. 

MITCHELL: Let's just talk recession. Because that seems inevitable? What does that mean to the average person? 

PRIME MINISTER: Well, again. Look, all I know is that the hit that the Australian economy is taking is the biggest than we've seen since the Great Depression. That is undisputed. I mean, the GFC was an entree compared to what this is. This is at a whole another level. And that's why it's important to ensure that we try and keep businesses as intact as possible during the course of the, the most debilitating impact of this virus on our economy. That's what JobKeeper’s about, that’s what doubling JobSeeker’s about. That's what the cash flow lifeline putting into business is all about. That's what the tenancy arrangement is all about. So on the other side, our businesses are not beaten down by obligations and debt burdens. And having been folded and being pursued by creditors and the landlords and these sorts of things so they can get going again.

MITCHELL: But given how much we rely on the rest of the world surely recession is inevitable. Now we’re judged differently on the unusual circumstances, it is not the usual failures of management or something, but recession is inevitable isn’t it?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, again, I never concede to the inevitability of anything when it comes to the economy. I like to think that there is always the things that we can do to try and make things better. Now, on the economy, we've got some really bad news coming our way. I mean, yesterday we had the unemployment figures and that’s probably one of the last sets of relatively good news that we're going to see for some time. So whatever these figures are going to end up saying Neil, whether it's in the terms that you're talking about or anything else. All I know is this thing is going to hit us like a truck. And we need to ensure that on the other side of that and through it, we're doing everything we can to ensure the recovery is as strong as possible. Now, whether it's V-shaped or U-shaped or whatever shape you want to come up with. It'll be as best as possible the shape we make it. And that is to see employees getting back into jobs, businesses getting going again, exports firing up again and to get to that position as soon as we can. 

MITCHELL: I know you've announced some money going to Virgin and Qantas. But if, they want a lot more Virgin, will you let them go under if necessary? 

PRIME MINISTER: We do want to see two, we do want to see- sorry there’s a different call coming in on the other line, we want to have two airlines in Australia that are commercially viable that are there and into the future. Of course, we all want that. There's no dispute about that. 

MITCHELL: But will you pay to get it?

PRIME MINISTER: But what I'm saying is I'm not going to get in the way of a commercial resolution to this. 

MITCHELL: Even if it means Virgin goes under?

PRIME MINISTER: What I'm saying is I understand and know that there are all sorts of commercial discussions going on right now. And the worst thing I could do as a Prime Minister or as a government is get in the way of that. So I want to see them fix that. 

MITCHELL: Even if China wants, well although it’s pretty well foreign owned anyway, even if China wants to buy it?

PRIME MINISTER: But all I'm saying is there are commercial discussions underway, Neil. I'm not going to get in the way of those. I'm not going to pre-empt those, I’m going to let them do their work. And I wish them every success.

MITCHELL: Just in a general sense, as the JobKeeper. There are some glitches there. Council employees can't get it, but AFL players can. Obviously, it's been put together in a hurry as it needed to be,

PRIME MINISTER: No, that's not a glitch. That’s not a glitch. State governments are responsible for state government employees, which includes local government employees. And there was an agreement of National Cabinet that we're all responsible in the public sector for our own workers. So, you know, we look after the Commonwealth workers and the state government looks after local government workers. That's why on child care, we're paying the 50 per cent continuity payments for all child care centres, including local government ones. But when it comes to the wage subsidies, that is the responsibility of the state government. And in New South Wales, they've done exactly that for local government run childcare centres.

MITCHELL: Okay, I’ll raise that with the state Treasurer a little bit later. But there are glitches turning up, which are legitimate ones where do people go to sort them out. Do they go to their local member of parliament or where do they go to sort it out? 

PRIME MINISTER: Well, they can do that. But I mean, they can also work it out through the ATO, who are administering the program, one of our key principle through all of this, whether it's JobKeeper or JobSeeker or childcare or universities or whatever, it is. One of our principles that we learnt from the GFC was you've got to use existing distribution mechanisms. You can't come up with new schemes with new systems, because that creates even more problems. And so let's take one of the issues that's often raised about casuals who may not have been working up to the 1,500 bucks a fortnight level of hours, but getting a $1,500 JobSeeker payment now. The alternative is that that casual if they'd been there for more than twelve months, and they'd be on JobKeeper, they would go down the road and they would apply for JobSeeker now they'd end up getting roughly about the same. And the difference would be that we're delivering it through a more effective mechanism, through the JobKeeper payment through the business, then rather putting the pressure on JobSeeker, which is under a lot of pressure. I've got 6,000 extra people right now working on processing all of those claims and I want to keep the pressure off that so I can get people money through the welfare system. 

MITCHELL: Just quickly, you won't like this, but it is relevant. Malcolm Turnbull's book, he says that you and Mathias Cormann were a significant tension that only matters now, it's history but that only matters now if you don't get on. Is there a bit of tension between Mathias, between you and Mathias Cormann?

PRIME MINISTER: No.

MITCHELL: Was there ever?

PRIME MINISTER: Mathias and I have worked together on six budgets together. 

MITCHELL: But you were a leaker and he didn't like it according to Malcolm Turnbull?

PRIME MINISTER: Oh look, I’m going to let all those go through the keeper Neil. I'm focussed very much on the job Australians want me focussed on, and I'm very committed to. I'll leave it to everyone else. 

MITCHELL: And I read you are in isolation at the Lodge with your family is that right?

PRIME MINISTER: Ah, I wouldn't say I’m in isolation. I'm just doing the same thing that all Australians are doing. And I've got the family with me at the moment, it’s school holidays. And my hope is that very soon in New South Wales that they'll go back to classroom learning. And when they do that, my kids will be back in Sydney, going to school every day. 

MITCHELL: Thank you so much for your time. I appreciate it. Thank you.

PRIME MINISTER: Good talking to you, cheers.

https://pmtranscripts.pmc.gov.au/release/transcript-42786

Interview with Leigh Sales, 7.30 Report

16 April 2020

LEIGH SALES: Prime Minister, thank you for your time.
 
PRIME MINISTER: Thanks, Leigh.
 
SALES: I want to start by stepping back and giving viewers total clarity on what the Government’s overall strategy is. It’s still accurate, isn’t it, that Australia’s goal is flattening the curve, not total elimination and not herd immunity, which are the two ends of the spectrum. 
 
PRIME MINISTER: That's exactly right. It's called the suppression strategy. That was the advice from the medical expert panel again today and I think that summarises it well. And what you need to do is all of those things, but you need to have in place an economic support package which enables you to do that and keep people with income and so you'll be able to work through that suppression strategy and ultimately be able to bring the economy up more strongly to be in a position where you can both suppress the virus and at the same time have enough activity in the economy that supports people's incomes. 
 
SALES: So I’ll come to the economy later, I just want to stick with health for the first part of the interview. So does this strategy mean that Australia is prepared to live with a certain number of cases and deaths as long as it doesn’t overwhelm the health system?
 
PRIME MINISTER: Well, what we've seen in Australia is we're pursuing a suppression strategy. But per head of population, we've actually got a lower number of cases than New Zealand that is pursuing the other strategy. See, the other strategy requires very extreme economic measures, but we're actually getting a better result with more flexible measures. And so it is quite possible, Leigh, that by pursuing the suppression strategy, you actually get eradication as a by-product and the Chief Medical Officer said that today. So one doesn't necessarily exclude the other. It's more about the level of economic restrictions that you're prepared to put in place, which also come at a great cost both to lives and livelihoods. 
 
SALES: I guess what I’m trying to get to is are authorities working on the basis of a number of cases every week that Australia could reasonably tolerate and if so what is that number?
 
PRIME MINISTER: No, we're not. What we're working on, and we talked about this today, and this is the effective rate of transmission, and if that is below a score of one, then that means that basically we have the transmission of the virus in Australia under effective control. And that's where we currently are right now. We've been there and in each state, except for Tasmania, for over a week and what's important over the next few weeks is we keep it in that level and that we build up three things. First of all, we need to have an even broader testing program, a surveillance testing network, which means we can get on top and identify any outbreaks early. Secondly, we need to be able to have an industrial level-type tracing capability of cases. Now, the manual arrangements that have been put in place by the states have been magnificent. But to ensure that we can lift our level of activity, we need an even better system of tracing. And thirdly, we need the capacity to respond to outbreaks where they occur very effectively and we're seeing a form of that in north west Tasmania right now. So if we can get those three things in place at a stronger level over the next four weeks, then we believe we'd be in a position to reduce the baseline level of restrictions that we currently have. 
 
SALES: On those three things, with the testing, when will that be broadened and what would broadened testing look like?
 
PRIME MINISTER: Well, it wouldn't be just where the issues are symptomatic or people are at high risk, this would be more broader, a random type surveillance testing because you need to know where it might break out at any point in time. Now, that is another level beyond where we are now. Now, right now, we have one of the best testing regimes in the world and have had for many weeks. And the level of accuracy we're getting on how many cases we have of what we believe is out there is also one of the highest in the world. But to ensure that…
 
SALES: But is what you’re talking about, would I be getting say, when you say sort of random testing, would I get a phone call to say your neighbourhood has an outbreak so you need to come in for a test? Like how would it work?
 
PRIME MINISTER: Quite possibly, even without that type of situation arising, because of what's called sentinel testing. It's actually out there trying to see where the virus has moved where you may not even have an indication that there is a particular risk because it's basically trying to work out where outbreaks may occur. And that's how you stay on top of it.
 
SALES: And then how about an antibody test where we’re able to mass test the population and discover who has already had coronavirus?
 
PRIME MINISTER: Well, those sorts of tests, my advice is, are still not at a level of accuracy that you could put a lot of store in them. That's my understanding. What's important is the tests we have been using and we've also been working with the Doherty Institute here in Australia to ensure that we can have better domestically based testing arrangements. So the sort of testing we're talking about at the moment is the sort of testing that people have been seeing and we've been able to access greater supplies of that testing equipment. And that's what's also necessary to go to this next phase. So testing, tracing and response, they are the three critical weapons we need to combat the virus and at the same time be able to lift your level of economic activity.
 
SALES: And then on the second one, tracing, we’ve been hearing a little bit this week about this tracing app that Australians might be asked to download. When will that be ready to go?
 
PRIME MINISTER: Well, it's not ready yet. I would like to see it ready in the next fortnight. I indicated that the other day. The technical side of it has been going well and we've been effectively using the code of the technology that was used in Singapore, based on a meeting I had with Prime Minister Lee a few weeks ago and we appreciate their support in that. But there are a lot of issues that we still have to resolve for its use in Australia and the privacy issues are paramount amongst that. The Attorney-General is spending a lot of time on that at the moment, but the purpose of this tracing app is pretty straightforward. Right now, if you were to be diagnosed with contracting the coronavirus, Leigh, the authorities would get in touch with you and they would identify the critical time when you might have been in a position where you might have infected others and they would want to know every name and every phone number and then they'll ring them all up. That's what happens right now. 
 
What you can do with technology, with a permission-based app, is that where two of the phones that have downloaded the app are in contact with each other for a period of 15 minutes or more, then those numbers can go into a secure encrypted location, not in the phones, not available to either of those users, that can be unlocked where someone has been identified as having contracted the virus and that's been identified by a medical professional. And then in that case, the medical authorities have the numbers and they can get in contact and that can be done very quickly. Now, this is a bit like war bonds, Leigh. In the war, people bought war bonds to get in behind the national effort. What we're doing in fighting this fight is we'll be asking people to download an app which helps us trace the virus quickly and the more people who do that, the more we can get back to a more liveable set of arrangements.
 
SALES: So say we get the testing, the tracing and the local response capability up in the next four weeks, and that’s going well and the numbers are going well, what are the first of the restrictions that would be eased in four weeks’ time?
 
PRIME MINISTER: Well, already we're going to want to move and are on things like construction and manufacturing and those types of activity, and today we talked at National Cabinet in particular about things like infrastructure and how we can get some of those works moving. But once you go to the next phase, I mean, in the retail area, there will be opportunities there. I think what you'll see is more people being able to work at work, that might be on a roster type basis. I mean, some of that is happening now already. But what we are looking to do, and schools also come into that ultimately, and what we're looking to do is get the pace, get the churn, the activity in the economy moving back up. Because when that happens, then people's jobs come back into play. Their incomes come back more strongly. And their reliance on the welfare system and the JobKeeper program will diminish over time. The way out of this is to get on top of the virus and to get people back into work and in their incomes. When we do that, we're winning.
 
SALES: If we can turn to schools that you mentioned, their operation is a decision for states. The health advice is that children aren’t at risk. Teachers are at risk, like any worker in any workplace that forces you to mix with other people. Is there any reason that schools shouldn’t reopen sooner rather than later, with teachers adopting protective measures?
 
PRIME MINISTER: Well, that's the advice from the medical expert panel. The issue that I think is confusing, though, is that the health advice is that the children are safe, that the risk for children at school is very low. But for teachers, it's different. For adults, the risk is different. Now, where are the adults at risk? The adults are at risk when they're with each other. So teachers are at more risk in the staffroom than they are in the classroom. The other place where they're at risk is during school drop off and pick up, where there might be groupings of parents. That needs to be better arranged to ensure that teachers aren’t at risk there. There's also a range of issues about hygiene in schools and clean down of play equipment and the application of sanitizer and all those things that need to be in place, like there is in many other work environments right now. There also needs to be the arrangements to if there is a case in a school about how those procedures are handled. They're all very fair and reasonable things that are necessary when you're dealing in a COVID environment and they can all be achieved. Now, Victoria's already gone back, they’ve set their arrangements for now and that's fair enough. If you live in Victoria, listen to the Victorian Premier. If you live in New South Wales, listen to the New South Wales Premier. They'll have slightly different arrangements, but they're all working to the same goal in that, ultimately, we want to get children back to school, learning in a classroom in front of a teacher, because that's the best place for a child to get their education.
 
SALES: Teachers are currently being asked to do two jobs, which is to run online classes but also to be available to work in the schools for kids who still attend. Is that workload really fair or sustainable for them?
 
PRIME MINISTER: Well, it's challenging, I don't doubt that at all. But there are some teachers who shouldn't be at school, particularly teachers who might be in older age groups, who might have other health conditions and things like that, and where the school leadership and the school system is able to better deploy their skills in online environments and things like that. They're issues that practically have to be worked through in the school system. But the ability for, I know in some states, they're considering actually having the classrooms where students would be there getting face to face learning and that being streamed to students who can't do that for other reasons. So, look, there are many options here and Australians are incredibly innovative and no less so than in our teaching profession. I know how passionate our teachers are about teaching. I know for so many teachers, they'll be… I mean, they love teaching kids and they'll be, you know, they'll be finding it hard to be away from them. 
 
SALES: And quickly, before we move on from this, will your daughters go back to school when schools open in New South Wales?
 
PRIME MINISTER: When I can send my kids to school and they get taught in a classroom, face to face, that's what I want my kids to do. At present, that's not available to me. And right now, it's school holidays, so they're with me right now. But this is where we want them to be. If, you know, when the school that they attend is providing those face to face lessons, Leigh, those classroom lessons then I can assure you, that's where I want my kids. And the sooner the better, from my point of view.
 
SALES: If we can switch now more to look at the economy, I want to show people some of the latest graphs from the Federal Health Department. The first of these graphs shows the number of cases by age group in Australia, and you can see that it’s pretty evenly spread across ages. Most cases are people in their 20s. But when you look at deaths, the deaths are heavily in the 70s and 80s age brackets, with zero deaths in Australia under 50. Is it fair to say that the people who are bearing the hardest burden of the economic shutdown are not the people who are at the most serious health risk?
 
PRIME MINISTER: Well, I think that is a reasonable assumption to make, but I don't think they would consider the death of any Australian would be an unreasonable burden to carry for the sake of another one of their fellow Australians. 
 
SALES: Are authorities worried, though, that when you look at graphs like that, that if the hard lockdowns last too long, Australians under 50 could start rebelling and pushing back against the destruction of their jobs and livelihoods?
 
PRIME MINISTER: Well, sure, it is a social contract. I don't deny that for a second, I think there's a social license here with governments about how these arrangements are put in place. And I can assure you no one wants these restrictions in any longer than they have to be. It's one of the reasons why we don't go for that complete eradication strategy. a) I mean, it's very elusive. And the costs to those livelihoods, as you are saying a very significant with no real clear additional benefit at least from what the evidence we're getting at the moment. So, yeah, I think it is getting that balance right Leigh. 
 
One of the things that we have consistently said as a National Cabinet and I've particularly said as Prime Minister and our government has said, and that is we've got to fight this war on two fronts. You can win the health war and lose the economic war. And, but you've got to, you've got to deal with both of them at the same time. And that's what we're doing. We will move these restrictions when we can get the health protections in place, because this is what happens if you don’t, if we don't get those three things in place - because I've heard this theory, just go and let it go now. And if you know, if it gets worse, we'll do it all again. We'll tell you what happens then. The outbreak gets so severe, and if you want to know what it looks like, go and look at New York, go and look at London, go and look at Spain. All of those places, that could be Australia. We should not kid ourselves that the success we've had at the moment protects us from ending up where they are right now. If you don't keep it under control, it will get away from you quickly and then you'll have to lock down even harder. And the economic costs will be even worse. 
 
SALES: Do you accept that there’s been some inconsistency in the restrictions that people find annoying? For example, why can’t I sit in a park by myself and read a book but I can go on a bus with other people.
 
PRIME MINISTER: Oh look, on the practical level, on the ground and the way the states are implementing these issues, Leigh, of course it's difficult. I mean, we are in unprecedented, uncharted times. And look, I think people have been very understanding of these issues and I think everyone's working to try and get these issues as consistent as they can. And that's why when we get that cooperation, when we can get cooperation, say, on this tracing app when it comes out, then I think a lot of these issues will move away because we've got the tools in place to be able to track these things down very quickly and respond. So there is a, there is a give and take here. There's a bit of a contract here. These tools are there to help every Australian to have a more- less restrictive environment, a stronger economy and helping save lives.
 
SALES: I received an email this afternoon from a primary school principal in New South Wales and she said, ‘I don’t understand why I’m unable to see my grandson and yet I can see other people’s grandchildren on a daily basis because I lead a school of 300 children?’
 
PRIME MINISTER: Well, I made the point before that people who are in those more sensitive cohorts, those who are more vulnerable then there are- there is advice which is suggesting that those individuals should be constrained from their access to others and that they are actually more at risk in that environment actually from the other teachers, as I said before. But the protection of those who are elderly and why they've been kept isolated is for their protection. But equally, if they're in a workplace that might have some vulnerabilities. Well, the same point would apply.
 
SALES: On that point, Prime Minister, there are some business leaders who would like to see a return to a sort of normal existence for everyone under 60 and lockdown measures restricted to older Australians and younger people with serious health issues. Would something like that ever happen?
 
PRIME MINISTER: Well, I've found during the course of this Leigh that I get lots of health advice from business people and lots of business advice from doctors. What I tend to do is focus on the health advice from those who are expert there. And on the business advice, I've been listening very carefully to both the economists and business leaders and others to getting our plans right. The COVID Commission, which is led by Nev Power, they're doing great work. David Thodey's on there and Jane Halton and a range of others. And Cath Tanner. They're doing tremendous work on the industry side of this to support how we get the private-private cooperation, the industry-government cooperation, and also thinking about what's ahead as well, about how we can grow our economy again on the other side of this to get the jobs back. Because while we've talked about a lot of these issues tonight, Leigh, I'm sure you'd agree, we want your viewers to know that on the other side, we get out of this and we return to a life that we are missing at the moment. But we will get again. But we're going to have to work hard for it in these months ahead and on the other side we're going to need policies that ensure our economy can grow quickly again and we can get back to that, those living standards that we're currently missing. 
 
SALES: On jobs, just on Virgin Australia, 15,000 Australian jobs are on the line. What they’re asking for from Government is a loan, not a handout. Is that something that can be delivered?
 
PRIME MINISTER: Well, we, of course, want to see two viable commercial airlines in Australia, and I'm concerned about all those jobs, I mean, JobKeeper is there to protect 6 million jobs. So the government has been very clear about our support for jobs. What we've been very careful here to do, is a couple of things. We are not going to get in the way of a market commercial solution to that issue in Virgin. And there are many things going on there. Secondly, we're going to make sure that anything we do in this space, like has been in other countries, that we would do it on a sector-wide basis. And so we've got some clear principles here. 
 
But what's very important is that we don't get in the way of a commercial solution, like the TWU super fund, I mean, the industry super funds in this country have got $3 trillion dollars worth of assets here we've got a company that needs capital. Its own workers have been paying in to industry funds and there are funds out there, in these super funds that could be investing in a number of companies. Now, I appreciate that comes in a different risk premium, but this is their own contributors that are involved here. And I'd like to see the industry and broader superannuation fund playing a more active role in dealing with the economic issues that we're dealing with at the moment. I mean, the government, the taxpayer is not the only economic actor in this event. There are many others. The banks are doing a great job, I've got to give them that credit. They are cushioning the blow. They are balancing things out in a lot of areas and they've stepped forward. And I know that banks have copped a lot of flak, including from me in the past. But during this crisis, I've got to thank them for the work that they're doing.
 
SALES: Prime Minister, thank you for your time.
 
PRIME MINISTER: Thanks a lot, Leigh. Good to be with you.

https://pmtranscripts.pmc.gov.au/release/transcript-42784

Update on Coronavirus Measures

16 April 2020

The National Cabinet met today to continue its coordinated work to save lives, and to save livelihoods.

Leaders thanked Australians for staying home where possible over the Easter long weekend and stressed the critical importance of continuing to adhere to self-isolation, social distancing and quarantine arrangements, particularly for returned travellers. National Cabinet also highlighted the importance of people who are self-isolating and registering on the COVID-19 app.

The Chief Medical Officer Dr Brendan Murphy provided an update on the measures underway on the latest data and medical advice in relation to coronavirus.

There are more than 6,400 confirmed cases in Australia and sadly 63 people have died. 

Testing keeps Australians safe. Australia has one of the most rigorous coronavirus testing systems in the world with more than 374,500 tests completed.

National Cabinet agreed that Australia will continue to progress a successful suppression/elimination strategy for the virus.

National Cabinet noted new modelling that has confirmed that measures put in place to suppress the virus have largely been successful in slowing and reversing the growth of cases in Australia to ensure our health system has the capability to manage the epidemic.

It is estimated that overall, Australia is currently detecting approximately 92 per cent of all symptomatic cases, with each state and territory individually detecting at least 80 per cent. Australia’s point estimate when compared with other countries is 84 per cent, the highest reported detection rate globally.

Modelling shows the current effective reproduction number, Reff for Australia and state and territories. For COVID-19 suppression strategies to be effective, Reff (the number of people a single case infects on average) needs to be less than 1.0. Currently, the results look very encouraging.

National Cabinet noted that Australia’s epidemiology has only seen limited instances of local acquisition with the vast majority of cases linked to overseas arrivals or close contacts.

National Cabinet further noted that Australia was now in the suppression phase of the response, which will last for some time. Restrictions will be reviewed regularly and planning for the medium to long-term has begun. Over the following months further enhancements of the public health response capability will be implemented to allow future considerations of some relaxation of distancing measures.

The Governor of the Reserve Bank of Australia, Philip Lowe, and the Treasury Secretary, Steven Kennedy, provided National Cabinet with an economic update.

National Cabinet agreed to meet again on Tuesday 21 April 2020.

Modeling the current impact of COVID-19 in Australia (16 April 2020)

Forward Planning Framework

National Cabinet agreed to a framework for future actions to plan the pathway for next steps in responding to the virus and conditions for relaxation.

National Cabinet agreed that any changes to the current measures must be underpinned by a strengthened public health response for case and contact identification and management, continued surge capacity in the healthcare system and a clear communications plan. 

AHPPC’s assessment is the precedent conditions required for change were unlikely to be in place within the next four weeks and cautioned against any material change in measures in this time. However, if Personal Protective Equipment (PPE) supply could be assured, there could be further consideration of recommencing some high value health service activity including elective surgery.
National Cabinet agreed to baseline measures remaining in place for the next four weeks, with individual states and territories who have put in place extended measures beyond baselines, to consider these measures based on up to date data and circumstances. 

National Cabinet agreed to AHPPC advice on seven precedent conditions to any further relaxations, with work to continue over the next four weeks.

1. Situational awareness of current measures and their impact – sophisticated surveillance of disease incidence and spread, health system status, public health capabilities, stocks of material and community adherence to public health measures.

2. Finalised surveillance plan – enabled with adequate resources.

3. A better understanding of the implications of the modelling and a better understanding of the characteristics and transmission of the virus.

4. Complete maturation of public health capacity – including capacity to conduct testing more broadly; and public health workforce and technology for contact tracing, data collection and analysis.

5. Advanced technology for contact tracing – the role of a mobile phone application should be wholly explored, as it could be a valuable tool in contact tracing if numbers increase and the application is widely taken up. This would act to complement and augment our current public health contact tracing strategies and enable scale-back strategies.

6. Assurance of adequate health system capacity – should control measures fail, there must be assurance that the system will cope with any surge in cases, including the requirement for hospital beds, ventilators, PPE and ongoing workforce training.

7. Assurance of supply lines for – PPE, pathology consumables, ventilators.

Leaders noted the AHPPC advice on international strategies being used to address COVID19 include an ‘eliminate’ strategy, ‘suppress’ strategy and ‘controlled transmission’ strategy. 

National Cabinet agreed that Australia will continue to progress a successful suppression/elimination strategy.
Leaders noted the AHPPC advice that there are very different epidemics occurring in different countries, which are closely aligned with the relevant local public health responses, including physical distancing measures, testing and contact tracing measures as well as broader health system capacity. Measures taken during the response to suppress the COVID-19 pandemic in Australia are aimed at protecting the most vulnerable population groups from severe illness and mortality by reducing transmission in the general population and ensuring health system capacity.

Schools

National Cabinet agreed with the AHPPC health advice that “on current evidence, schools can be fully open” along with the “practical guidance and advice” the AHPPC provided school leaders to even further reduce the “relatively low risk” of transmission in schools during the COVID-19 pandemic.

National Cabinet also agreed to a series of National Principles for School Education, as follows:

1. Our schools are critical to the delivery of high quality education for students and to give our children the best possible start in life. Our education systems are based on the recognition that education is best delivered by professional teachers to students in the classroom on a school campus.

2. It is accepted that during the COVID-19 crisis, alternative flexible, remote delivery of education services may be needed

3. Our schools must be healthy and safe environments for students, teachers and other staff to ensure the effective and efficient delivery of education to students.

4. State and Territory Governments and non-government sector authorities are responsible for managing and making operational decisions for their school systems respectively, subject to compliance with relevant funding agreements with the Commonwealth.

5. Decisions regarding the response to COVID-19 in the schooling sector must continue to be informed by expert, official, national and state-based public health and education advice, consistent with these national principles.

6. All students must continue to be supported by their school to ensure participation in quality education during the COVID 19 crisis.

7. The health advice consistently provided by the AHPPC is that attendance at a school campus for education represents a very low health risk to students. The advice also notes that appropriate practices must be employed at schools, like at other workplaces, to provide a safe working environment for school staff, including teachers, and that the specific AHPPC advice regarding school campuses should be followed.

Protecting and supporting people with disability

National Cabinet reaffirmed its commitment to ensuring the well-being of Australians with disability are considered as the coronavirus pandemic unfolds. 

National Cabinet endorsed the Management and Operational Plan for COVID-19 for People with Disability and agreed to its release on the Australian Government Department of Health’s website.

The Plan ensures a national approach to protecting and supporting people with disability, their families and carers during the pandemic by providing guidance on a range of factors that need to be considered in managing and preventing the transmission of COVID-19.

https://pmtranscripts.pmc.gov.au/release/transcript-43977

Interview with Gareth Parker, 6PR

15 April 2020

GARETH PARKER: Prime Minister of Australia, Scott Morrison, good morning.

PRIME MINISTER: G’day Gareth, how are you? 

PARKER: I'm okay. How are you? 

PRIME MINISTER: Mate, I'm fine. But we've got a lot of challenges ahead of us and we're all working together to address them and work our way through this and, and our way out of this. 

PARKER: Yeah. We'll come back to the way out of it in a moment. I want to start with the schools, which is obviously something that you have wanted to address directly to teachers today?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, first, my first point is I think teachers are fantastic and amazing and we've got to value them all the time. But particularly at times like this, when there are so many kids who are so dependent on them, those kids who, you know, like some others, don't have the same opportunities at home to be able to learn at home who could lose a whole year of their education at the moment, if we can't get this right and I'm very worried for those kids. I mean, it's alright for some kids and some families that might be able to make the adjustments here, but for vulnerable kids, kids of families whose, both parents are going to work. And if you've got a job in this economy, they're essential jobs. I don't care what the job is. And they need to keep going to work for the sake of the economy and their families. We need the schools to be able to support that. And that's the arrangements we have. But we need to strengthen them. And we also need to recognise that the best way to deliver education for kids, is in schools, on campuses, in classrooms, with teachers. That's the school system we have. If we thought there was another system through distance learning that was better, we'd do that. We don't do that. And I think we, there’s some, some hard facts we've got to acknowledge at the moment. I know it's tough for everyone, but I'm very concerned about the quality of education that is going to be delivered to our kids this year. 

PARKER: It seems there's a real equity issue here that is if, you know, middle class kids or middle upper class kids where parents can keep them home with a good laptop and a good Internet connection will fare better than kids who have, you know, a more chaotic home environment, a less fortunate home environment here. And you don't want that bridge to, well, you don't want that gap to widen more than already is?

PRIME MINISTER: That's true. And it's also about what happens at school. I kept my kids in school up until the last week because they weren't getting taught at school in that last week, I mean, they were sitting in a room looking at a screen, that's not teaching, that's childminding. And schools aren't for childminding. Schools are for teaching and they're for learning. And the point I'm trying to make, it isn't just about, you know, that kids can go along to school and sit in a hall and be minded. We want them to get educated. And it's very important that happens. And, you know, we are going to lose a lot of things during this crisis. And I don't want that to be the education of our children. I mean, we're on school holidays now in New South Wales. And so obviously the kids are home. But I would, I would have them back in school in a heartbeat if they were getting taught at school. But at the moment, we're fortunate our kids can have a learning environment at home, but not all kids can. And I know schools will always remain open for kids to go. But it's the learning there that I want to take place, not just the minding. 

PARKER: So we've spoken on this program and like New South Wales, Western Australia's at the start of the two week school holiday period at the moment, we've spoken to the education minister, Sue Ellery, we spoke to the Premier earlier in the program today, I think it's fair to say that W.A. is sort of on a unity ticket with you here. Do you want the schools open fully for business as of day one of term 2, or does it need to be tailored to whatever each individual state’s health situation is with the testing numbers? Because obviously here in the West, we're in a reasonable position at the moment?

PRIME MINISTER: Yeah, and look, and I totally respect the fact that every state and territory has got to make their own choices on this and set their own arrangements in place. It's not a federal issue. It is run by the states. So there's no creep here from the federal government trying to tell states and territories what to do, they've got to make their own decisions. And through the National Cabinet, which Premier McGowan has been a great supporter of and contributor to, we're trying to get as much consistency as we can. But you're right, there are different risks in different states. If you think about Victoria and New South Wales, obviously the risks are far greater at the moment and to arrange for more and more people to go back to school, it's not just ensuring that the safety of obviously the teachers in the classroom, from a health point of view, it's your pick up and drop off, and to make sure appropriate distancing is being practiced there when you have got parents coming and all that needs to be sorted out. That's why I think from the first day back after school holidays, it's unlikely to look very different to what it did before you went into school holidays. But I do know that over the weeks that then follow, there is an opportunity to move to an even better model. Now, ultimately, you know, I can't see a time during this Covid crisis where, you know, there would be any mandatory position put on parents who really did not want their children to go to school. I understand that and I respect that. I mean, as a Liberal, I've always believed in parental choice when it comes to these issues. And I think that's an important principle, but in the main, I mean, in South Australia, they went into the school holidays with greater than 50 per cent school attendance, in New South Wales it was 5 per cent. I mean, it is possible to get a higher level of school attendance and going back to actual functional learning in classrooms, at schools, that is safe for teachers. And I want to stress we believe it must be safe for teachers and not just have attendance at school as kids sitting in a hall in front of a screen. That's the balance that we need educationalists, teachers, school leaders, parents, everyone working together to get us to a more sustainable model than the one we sort of eased into the term break with. 

PARKER: And I think the point about safety for teachers is what some teachers are telling me. They're saying, look we are, we are happy to teach, but we can't in our own minds reconcile the inconsistency between the advice to people all over the community to practise social distancing yet those rules don't apply in my classroom?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, the health advice is very important here. Their workplace is different to everyone else's workplace and the health advice and the research shows that teachers are more likely to catch coronavirus in the staff room than they are in the classroom because of the incidents and the transmissibility of the virus amongst children. Now, if you're in a workplace with lots of children, that's different to being in a workplace with lots of adults. And the health advice is that children can safely go to school. Now, what we're talking about here, I think ultimately, is not full attendance at school, but a functional attendance at school, which enables lessons to be done at school. Obviously, the populations will be lower, which is greater opportunity to ensure better social distancing practices in the classrooms which protect teachers. I think that's appropriate. There will be some teachers who should not be in a school environment. Importantly, in the staffroom, because they are more at risk than many others in the community. If they're over 65 or if they're over 55 and they're indigenous, they have other co-morbidities or other health issues. That's all totally understood. I mean, I've had these discussions with the education unions at a national level. I totally respect the need to protect people in their workplace. But equally, I value greatly the job that teachers do in teaching kids face to face and ensuring that they can have a good learning outcome this year and not have their education wasted away.

PARKER: You mentioned the road out of this. I think that in Australia we are in a very good position at the moment, but there are no easy decisions from here. You said last week that we have bought time to consider options going forward. Can you elaborate on that?

PRIME MINISTER: Yeah, well, the 6 months that we have over, you know, from effectively the start of this month to the end of September, that has been bought by the JobKeeper and Jobseeker arrangements we've put in place the free childcare, the support for our hospitals and universities and all of that to keep them functioning during this very, very strained period. And what we now need to do, having got all of those supports in place, having got our ICU capacities being upgraded and to, getting the production of personal protective equipment and getting access to testing and all of these, by doing all that, we now have the time to put in place a set of arrangements which not just now, but in the hopefully not too distant future. Many, a few, a few, many weeks from now, perhaps sooner in W.A. that's a matter for the Premier that we would be able to ease some of these, not all of them, but ease some get some businesses back into operation, get more people back to work. Get more kids back into schools, which will mean that our economy will be able to support more people and they won't become reliant on JobKeeper or Jobseeker. And that's what we have to do to sustain, to get back. But what we have to do to achieve that is we need an even broader testing regime than we have now. We have one of the best testing regimes in the world, but it still needs to be broader than it is now to provide that certainty that where outbreaks occur, we can, we can clamp down on them very quickly, that our tracing capacity is very important and you would have seen in the media reports that we were working on an app that will massively help our health authorities trace where people have been in contact with others. I mean, that type of technology is being used in other countries. And we've got to work through some technical and some privacy issues and some things like that. So we're not doing it in haste.

PARKER: Do you think people would be willing to do that? Do you think people would be willing to download an app that sends their movement information to the government? 

PRIME MINISTER: Well, it would only be in an instance where someone had coronavirus. You wouldn't be mandatorily required to sign up to these apps. That's not how Australia works. But I don't know, you tell me? If people believed and understood that if we could trace people's contacts quicker and tracked down the coronavirus faster and save people's lives, which meant we could open our economy up more. Well, it's a bit like buying war bonds during the war. I mean, there are things that we might not ordinarily do. But in these circumstances, to keep people safe, to save lives and to save people's livelihoods and get them back to work. If that tool is going to help people do that, then this may be one of the, one of the sacrifices we need to make, we’re working on the privacy issues very hard. 

PARKER: Yeah, reports are that as many as 40 per cent of the population might need to download it for it to work. Is that right or not? 

PRIME MINISTER: Yes, it is. You'd need at least that. And it's an important tool that other countries have successfully been able to use. And we've based it on what, well we've basically taken with their support, out of Singapore, where it's already in operation. And when I spoke with the Singaporean prime minister some weeks ago, he agreed, and we spoke about it. And he's given us support by giving us access to the coding for how this can be done. So that's important and we thank them for that. There are different apps being done by other companies. But what would be essential here is that the only people who would get the information and the only information they would get, is people that someone who had contracted coronavirus had come in contact during the potential infection period for a period of 15 minutes or more. And what would happen then is the health authorities who would be the only ones who’d have access to that data, would contact those people just like they do now. When they ask someone who has coronavirus, well, who were you with during that period of time? Well, they're seeking that information now anyway. This would just enable us to get it more quickly and not be relying on people's memories, which at the end of the day would mean we'd save more lives and save more livelihoods and protect people from the virus.

PARKER: Sort of just a more efficient version of contact tracing?

PRIME MINISTER: It is.

PARKER: So some people are starting to advance the proposition, Prime Minister, that the measures that we've taken to slow the spread of the virus are worse than the consequences of the virus. That is that the economic damage is worse than the health crisis. What do you make of those criticisms? 

PRIME MINISTER: I think they should Google Italy, the United Kingdom, New York, any of these countries will do, Spain, Sweden, the Netherlands. And look at the horror show that's happening there and ask themselves the same question. 

PARKER: So you're just not having it at all. Basically, you think that we've bought ourselves time with these measures and we can now find a way back from the situation we find ourselves in?

PRIME MINISTER: Absolutely. I think we can. And no country at the moment has been able to successfully chart that course yet. But we're in a better position than many and most, to be able to do that. And I think the West is also in a good position to do that. The National Cabinet has been a great forum to exchange ideas. Not everybody will be in the same situation. Others will be able to trial things more and earlier than others. And we'll all learn from that. And I think if you go back to the Spanish flu over a century ago, or about a century ago, one of the things that went terribly wrong then was that the states and territories did not work with, well the states I should say, didn't work well together with the Commonwealth. They all went their own way and fought with each other. That's not happening. And it's been a great privilege to work with other leaders from all political stripes to just focus on people's lives and livelihoods. 

PARKER: When parliament last week, you made a speech talking about economic sovereignty and the importance of Australia asserting its economic sovereignty. Well, what does that mean? Does that mean cutting ties with China? 

PRIME MINISTER: What it means is that we need to ensure that in Australia we have a domestic capability in our industries, whether that's on fuel. We already have a high level of food security, our manufacturing capability, all of these things that right now we've had to work very hard to either initiate or expand to meet critical supplies in medical equipment and other things like that. Now, that means I mean, it's not an argument for nationalisation, I can assure you that's certainly not in the head of our government, but it is about ensuring that we can have profitable, competitive, successful industries in Australia doing these things and the right policy environment to support that. We are already moving to diversify our trade base. That was already happening. And yes, China has been our biggest trading partner. But let's remember that that is predominated by the resources sector, which is obviously very relevant in Western Australia and Queensland. But with services exports and broader product exports for Australia, they are going to a much broader range of countries, the free trade agreement with Japan and South Korea, with Indonesia most recently, with Singapore we just signed a digital trade agreement with them just a few weeks ago, and of course, working with the UK and Europe. Now all of that will at the moment, won't be as much of a level of activity given what's happening with the global virus. But it's important that we do diversify and also have a capability here that is sustainable economically. Not, not off the taxpayer, but off of a genuine, credible, viable commercial operation. 

PARKER: There's just a couple of very quick ones before I let you go. The President of the United States, Donald Trump, announced that he would suspend funding for the WHO while they investigate whether it's handled the Covid crisis properly. Good move. Bad move?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, look, I sympathise with his criticisms and I've made a few of my own. I mean, we called this thing weeks before the WHO did. If we were relying on their advice, then I suspect we would have been suffering the same fate that many other countries currently are. We were calling it a pandemic back in early January or mid-January, I should say. 

PARKER: Was the WHO pandering to China? 

PRIME MINISTER: Look, I'm not going to get into that. But what I am going to say is, look, while I have many criticisms of the WHO, and most significantly, the unfathomable decision that they've had about wet markets, and there are lots of different kinds of wet markets. I'm talking about the ones that have wildlife and, you know, I won't go into a colourful description, but to be sanctioning that is just completely mystifying to me. But that said, the WHO is also as an organisation does a lot of important work, including here in our own region in the Pacific, and we work closely with them so that we're not going to throw the baby out with the bathwater here. But they're also not immune from criticism and immune from doing things better.

PARKER: Jacinda Ardern in New Zealand says that she and everyone else will take a 20 per cent pay cut among the politicians and the senior public servants. Will you consider that here?

PRIME MINISTER: We’ve already said there won't be any pay rise or any of those changes right across the public service. And this is not something that's currently before us. 

PARKER: Not a 20 per cent pay cut though?

PRIME MINISTER: It's not something that's being considered.

PARKER: Fair enough.

PRIME MINISTER: Let me tell you what's happening with public servants in this country at the moment. I've got 6,000 public servants, some of whom we've just recently contracted, others who are working at senior levels in the public service, sitting down at Centrelink right now, processing people's Jobseeker applications. I've got people in the public service that are working like they've never worked before I suspect, they do a great job. And they’re as much on the frontline saving people's livelihoods as, frankly, nurses working in hospitals. They're getting payments to people that they desperately need to get through, you know, the weeks and months ahead. So everyone's working hard. Everyone is working hard here. And everyone is in a job as in an essential job. And I just want to support them in those jobs. I'm not keen to get into a competition. 

PARKER: Prime Minister, thank you very much for your time. 

PRIME MINISTER: Thanks a lot. Cheers. 

https://pmtranscripts.pmc.gov.au/release/transcript-42783

Interview with Brett Mason, SBS

14 April 2020

BRETT MASON: Prime Minister, welcome back to SBS.

PRIME MINISTER: Thanks Brett. Good to be here.

MASON: You've spoken about National Cabinet working towards a road out of the coronavirus crisis, in your eyes, what does success look like on the other side? 

PRIME MINISTER: Well, ultimately, we want to get Australia back to normal, but there will be many steps between that point, and where we are now. This is something that we have to get used to and we have to get used to it at a much higher level of economic activity and be able to cope with that in the future. So no country has found the magic formula to this yet, and Australia is better placed than most and many because of the strong position we went into this in.

MASON: There does seem to be a sense within the community of, okay, we've gotten through the worst of this. We can start to wind back some of those restrictions. You're pretty adamant we're not at that point yet?

PRIME MINISTER: No, that is complacency and it's a dangerous complacency. And I warned against it. We still have quite a number of things to still get in place to have the protections there that would enable those sort of restrictions to be eased many, many weeks from now. We want to avoid the horrific scenes that we've seen overseas. I mean, this idea of some herd immunity, well they're not achieving that in Italy. They’re not achieving it in the United States and, or in the United Kingdom for that matter. And look at that horrific scenes there. I don't want to see that visited on Australia and so we need to be very careful, this thing can get away from you quickly, I mean Singapore’s curve is going up, it’s not flat, and Singapore was one of the example jurisdictions just a few weeks ago, so we cannot be complacent.

MASON: You've spoken about the virus moving in waves. How crucial were Chinese Australians in stopping the devastating impacts of that first wave of coronavirus heading out of China?

PRIME MINISTER: The amazing work of the Chinese Australian community, Australians coming home and self-isolating as they were asked to do, that has put Australia in a very strong position. It was the amazing compliance and cooperation and diligence and patience shown by the Chinese Australian community that saved Australian lives, including many in that community. And they were phenomenal. And I thank them very much.

MASON: You've spoken about this virus not having a face or a flag. Unfortunately, some Australians don't see it that way. In recent weeks, we've seen some appalling and horrific incidences of racism, Australians attacking other Australians on the streets. How disappointed have you been by those attacks?

PRIME MINISTER: I'm massively disappointed. Because it's just so wrong. It's so against who we are as a people. I mean, we're all in this together. It was the Chinese Australian community that actually protected Australia so early on in this virus outbreak around the world. They should call it out. And it's not on. It's, it's not how we get through this together. Sure the virus started in Wuhan, in China, that's what happened, that's just a fact. But that doesn't mean that this was, it has any nationalistic, or or any other sort of characteristics to it. That's just where it started.

MASON: The human rights commissioner has called for non-violence, or low risk detainees to be released from detention as a precaution to prevent a potential cluster of COVID-19 cases?

PRIME MINISTER: They’re not decisions the government’s taken, and it's an issue that's under constant review by the Australian border force and we’re putting the health interests first, but that's not a measure that has been taken.

MASON: Do you think this will be one of the biggest challenges that the region’s faced together with Australia?

PRIME MINISTER: I think so. I mean, what is happening in Indonesia is of terrible, great concern. And our thoughts are very much with them. And we're speaking regularly to our counterparts in Indonesia. The scale of their challenge is well beyond anything imaginable in Australia. And, you know, we need to be there and provide what support we can. But the scale of that challenge in Indonesia is unlike anything that we've seen in our time.

MASON: Two words have come to define this crisis in Australia, Ruby Princess. Why was that ship allowed to dock in Sydney and those passengers disembark?

PRIME MINISTER: We're in the middle of an unprecedented crisis. And there will be things that don't go according to plan. And that's not an excuse for it. That's just a reality. And if we allow ourselves to get so caught up in those things, sure, learn the lessons quickly.

MASON: What should have been done when that ship arrived?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, as you say, the rules were very clear about, Border Force is not a health agency, they don’t have doctors, that's not what their job is. I mean the New South Wales Government has been very clear about what's happened and I'm sure the lessons have been learned and we can move forward.

MASON: There’s been some criticism of the WHO for the time it took to declare a pandemic, you’ve raised some concerns about wet markets being allowed to re-open, is it time that the international community has a look at the World Health Organisation and some of the calls it’s made during the last few months? 

PRIME MINISTER: Well we didn’t rely on their calls. I mean we called this as a virus of pandemic potential well before the World Health Organisation and we went to the pandemic response stage well before the WHO even called it as one. So thankfully we weren’t relying on their calls in terms of how Australia responded. That obviously highlights some issues that I imagine need to be addressed there, but on the issue of the wet markets, I just find it baffling. I just don’t get it. And we want to be able to protect the world’s health from these sort of incubators of viruses and we really, I’m puzzled by the decision, I can’t really, I mean I’m not a health expert, the WHO are the ones who are supposed to provide those sorts of protections at a global level, and I do find the whole thing a bit mystifying.

MASON: Thank you very much.

PRIME MINISTER: Thanks Brett.

https://pmtranscripts.pmc.gov.au/release/transcript-42782

Interview with Chris Kenny, Sky News

14 April 2020

CHRIS KENNY: Prime Minister, thanks for joining us.

PRIME MINISTER: Thanks, Chris.

KENNY: When you go back six or eight weeks, when you looked at what might unfold in Australia because of the coronavirus, you must have been filled with apprehension at the very least. When you look at where we are at now from a public health point of view, you must be very, very pleased and relieved.

PRIME MINISTER: Australia has put itself in a good position to be able to deal with what is a global calamity. I mean, we go back to the decision we made when we put in the ban on foreigners coming to Australia from mainland China all those many weeks ago. We were one of the first, if not the first country to have that in place and that proved to be a very critical change. Many other countries didn't do that and sadly, and we've seen, you know, what has flowed in many of those countries around the world. And so, yes, we are in a stronger position than most and many, but we still have to chart our way out of this, having negotiated our way in with some good, strong measures to protect Australians and also to give a lifeline to our economy. But those lifelines are not infinite. I mean, they have a finite life and we are now working hard to chart our way out.

KENNY: What do you say to those who look at the number of deaths in Australia and, of course, the fact that we would normally have on a given day more than 400 people dying in this country, saying that is it is a very, very small additional death toll, that we are killing the economy, that it is time already to take the foot off some of these measures and free up the economy. Are they underestimating what this virus could do not just to the health of so many Australians but also to our health and hospital systems?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, of course they are, and it's a bit like when people say, well, if you haven't had any boats arrive in Australia, then why do you keep running a border protection regime? And of course, we've had many who have tried, but that's been an effective regime. Equally, you know, we spend billions and have for many, many years when it comes to protecting Australians from terrorists. And we've been able to thwart many terrorist attacks, 16. But, you know, that means you've got to keep your vigilance. This virus has the potential to do great damage to the health of Australians and their wellbeing and not just necessarily those in older age groups. As we've seen overseas, we've seen this move right through the community, and so it's very important that we remain very aware of the potential of where this pandemic can go in Australia and not become complacent because of our relative success. I mean, we don't want to end up like New York or like London or like in Spain or in Italy or any of these places. And the decisions and actions we've taken together as a country and the discipline and patience shown by Australians has meant that we've been able to avoid those horror scenarios which, you know, Australia is not immune to. I mean, we can sometimes have complacency in this country. We're optimistic people and that's great, but we also have to keep our sense of realism about the risk.

KENNY: Yeah, it’s so easy to look at, as you say, the UK or New York City and look at what the alternative is. I think people need to remind themselves of that. Nonetheless, I have been critical, as many have been, of state police forces a bit of overzealous policing of the social distancing rules. That’s not really your bailiwick, they’ll sort that out, but we have seen in Tasmania what can happen if people ignore the rules. The revelations we’ve heard today that medicos were involved in a dinner party that has led to a cluster of infections around the health system in northern Tasmania.

PRIME MINISTER: Well, it's being investigated, as the Premier has said, and it just is a reminder that we can't take these things for granted. I mean, yes, we've had a good couple of weeks, but that does not a virus beat. And that's why we have many more in front of us before we could even possibly contemplate the easing of restrictions. And as you say, the states and territories, they all have different enforcement regimes. They're different in Western Australia and South Australia to what they are in Victoria and New South Wales. But to be fair to Victoria and New South Wales, they have many more cases and a much larger population and a much bigger cultural change in the behaviours that we needed to see take place in those states. Now, I think the last few days over Easter have demonstrated that I think Australians have been getting the message and I thank them genuinely for the way that they are seeking to cooperate proactively with the measures that we've got. I believe that that will mean that that will enable us down the track to have, you know, a different type of regime in terms of how these things are enforced and I have no doubt that the states and territories will be considering that positively. I mean, there's got to be a reward for all of this great effort that's going in, and there will be. But we've got to make sure that's done at the right time.

KENNY: One of the real anomalies seems to be in schools, you and the Chief Medical Officer and the Deputy Chief Medical Officers have been arguing for a long while that the place for children at the moment should be in schools. Yet the larger states are going to an online model in the second term. Do you think that’s wise, you leave it up to them, or would you like to see kids back in schools as soon as possible?

PRIME MINISTER: We've been working to try and get a consistent approach and let's be clear about one thing. The health advice is very clear, and that is the children are not at risk by going to school. And what is at risk is teachers, particularly those in vulnerable groups, cohorts, ages, other vulnerable health issues being in the school environment and that's what needs to be addressed and that's why schools have moved to a mixture of online learning and in-class learning. Now, in places like South Australia, the school attendance rate is much higher than it is in, say, New South Wales and in Victoria, they're going back today on the model that was basically operating just before New South Wales schools went into the term break just last week. What is also important though, Chris, is the education outcomes for our kids. I've said it many times. This virus is going to take a lot of things from us. I do not want it to take a year of a child's education, precious years for these children. And you know, if online and distance learning was a better way of delivering education, then that's what we’d do all the time. We wouldn't have schools, we wouldn't have all of that infrastructure and all of these sorts of things. Of course, teaching in the classroom, teaching face to face, teaching in that environment with kids together is a positive environment for children to learn. And I think, you know, this has got to be a high priority, particularly given the health advice and the risk of children. We've got to get those issues right for the safety of teachers, that's fair enough. But ultimately, we need to get kids back into school and that's increasingly being recognised around the world. The French President has made similar comments today. But the health advice has been very consistent. Getting kids back into school will also free up, I think, more opportunities in our economy to get to more economic activity going. But in order to ease the sort of restrictions we've seen in place now, which have only been, frankly, a couple of weeks. To do that, we need a greater health capacity to be able to respond to these sorts of outbreaks and respond very effectively. We need a greater degree of tracing capability for contacts, and that can happen much more quickly than it does now, and a testing regime that is much more universal so we can get onto the outbreaks very quickly when they respond. Now, we have one of the best testing regimes in the world, but even that is not up to that scale yet, and so there's quite a bit more work to do before we can give ourselves the leave pass to be even contemplating easing those restrictions. 

KENNY: When it comes to schools, what’s the problem, though? Is it the teacher’s unions dictating terms to the state government?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, they’re discussions taking place between those unions and teachers themselves and the leadership of schools. It’s happening with independent schools, Catholic schools, as well as public schools. So, you know, it is a live debate. But I want to be clear what it's about and what it's not about. It's not about the health of kids. The medical advice has been completely consistent on that grounds, on that front. When it comes to the health and workplace environment of teachers, well, there are some legitimate issues there,  - that have been raised and which need to be addressed and that's what the medical expert panel has been working with the National Cabinet and myself on and there'll be further discussions about that this week.

KENNY: One group who seems to be very keen to get back to business as usual are the NRL. What hope do you give of the Sharks being out there at the end of next month?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, if they do go back, I hope they score a few more points than they did in the first two rounds. They have put in some good performances, I give them great credit. They were both close games. But look, I like the ambition because I want Australians to have the ambition to get things back to where they were. We all want that. No one wants to keep these sorts of restrictions in place any longer than they have to be. But right now, they are absolutely necessary to protect the health and livelihoods and lives of Australians. And so they will remain in place so long as we believe that is absolutely essential. But it's good to have plans to get the way back to where we want to be. That's what we're working on as a National Cabinet. This Thursday we will be considering further plans about how we can chart that way back to get the economy operating at a much higher level than it is now so it can support people's incomes, which will reduce the need to rely on taxpayers more broadly through the income supports that we've put in place. I mean, that's what we have to achieve. We've bought six months through the JobKeeper program and the JobSeeker program and the many other things we've done with child care and private hospitals and a lot of these changes to actually get this way out charted. This is a temporary set of arrangements where a government is responding in a crisis to an emergency set of conditions and these are the responses that are necessary to keep businesses together. Because we know on the other side, if the businesses can be held together with their employees, then we will be able to respond more quickly on the other side. Growth will take off far quicker than it would otherwise. You won't have people languishing for as long in unemployment or businesses, but, you know, in receivership or being pursued by creditors or by landlords or things like this. Our plan has always been about preserving businesses as the centre of the economy, not the government at the centre of the economy. Businesses are the centre of our economy, and we want to ensure that they get through this intact in as much a form as that we can so they can lead the recovery, the economic recovery on the other side.

KENNY: Just a couple of things very briefly, the Chinese Embassy has hit back at criticism over China’s handling over the coronavirus, claims they were slow to tell the rest of the world what was going on. Is Beijing culpable for what has gone on here?

PRIME MINISTER: I haven’t engaged in a commentary on other country’s policies and how they handle it. This is a wretched problem and one that is really, really pushing all governments to their limits in terms of getting the right answer for their country. In Australia, I've been very focused on getting the right answer for Australia, not looking to carbon copy solutions or policies from other places. We've been getting it right for our country, our economy, our values, how we do things. The virus obviously started up in China and it was transmitted from there. That's just a simple statement of fact, but that is not implying any criticism. It's just a recognition of what has occurred. I mean, one of the very important things we did, as I mentioned earlier in this discussion, was when we're able to lock off that travel from people coming from mainland China early and the work that was done, the patience and the isolation that was put in place by our Chinese-Australian community, which were our most at risk community back in early February, was fantastic. I mean, their actions, their self isolation, their support for each other, Chinese-Australians here in those early weeks of this outbreak has saved Australia from a far worse fate than the one we're experiencing now and I commend them.

KENNY: And most Australia, I think, have appreciated your leadership and to be fair the leadership of premiers, Labor and Liberal around the country, through your National Cabinet. It works. Getting the leaders together, making quick decisions. Can that stay in place forever, long after the virus has gone?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, look, I mean, its success to date, I think, commends itself. It's not really something we're turning our minds to at the moment. We're too focused on the decisions we've got to make every single week. But I think all of us feel it's been a very effective mechanism. The most effective we've seen the Federation, I think, ever operate as far as I can see, and that's been an important tool for the country to be able to do this. You look back at previous times of crisis, you look back, you know, during the Great Depression and what was happening back then with the Scullin Government and then what was able to be achieved in the Lyons Government. I mean, taking a step back into history, these sorts of things didn't exist. And, you know, we've seen in the past, you go back to the Spanish Flu back in Australia a century ago, it was the breakdown in how the states worked together that made that episode far worse than it otherwise had been. So was it an early lesson for us that we know we needed to ensure the Federation worked as a tight unit together. And I really do thank the other Premiers and Chief Ministers. I mean, everything is just checked at the door. We've all got jobs to do as leaders of governments, and that's to do the right thing by our people, and I hope that's what Australians are seeing. Because that's certainly what we're all doing our best to do.

KENNY: Just finally, Scott Morrison, you’ve suddenly ended up in a position where moreso, I would suggest, that any Australian outside of wartime. You’ve got enormous pressure on you, dealing with an enormous public health and economic issue. How are you bearing up? Where do you draw strength?

PRIME MINISTER: Thanks for the question, I appreciate your concern. And can I also thank many Australians who have written and emailed and rung in and in and posted on social media asking about us. We're fine, our family is great. I draw great strength from my family and my faith. And for my colleagues, my ministers are doing an outstanding job. They really are. Whether it's Greg Hunt over in Health, who's making sure we're getting that equipment and working so well with the states. Josh Frydenberg leading our economic charge. Dan Tehan and the work he's done in Education and childcare. I'll go get in trouble for not making them all. Karen Andrews doing amazing work, repurposing manufacturing lines to produce PPE equipment. I mean, the team is working together and that's what sustains me. I've got a great team, whether it's the National Cabinet I’m working with or my own team, my own colleagues are out in their electorates supporting them. This is how we get through. It is Team Australia, it's been said, and I draw great strength from that and the Australian people.

KENNY: Prime Minister, thanks so much for joining us.

PRIME MINISTER: Thanks, Chris. 

CHRIS KENNY: Prime Minister, thanks for joining us.

PRIME MINISTER: Thanks, Chris.

KENNY: When you go back six or eight weeks, when you looked at what might unfold in Australia because of the coronavirus, you must have been filled with apprehension at the very least. When you look at where we are at now from a public health point of view, you must be very, very pleased and relieved.

PRIME MINISTER: Australia has put itself in a good position to be able to deal with what is a global calamity. I mean, we go back to the decision we made when we put in the ban on foreigners coming to Australia from mainland China all those many weeks ago. We were one of the first, if not the first country to have that in place and that proved to be a very critical change. Many other countries didn't do that and sadly, and we've seen, you know, what has flowed in many of those countries around the world. And so, yes, we are in a stronger position than most and many, but we still have to chart our way out of this, having negotiated our way in with some good, strong measures to protect Australians and also to give a lifeline to our economy. But those lifelines are not infinite. I mean, they have a finite life and we are now working hard to chart our way out.

KENNY: What do you say to those who look at the number of deaths in Australia and, of course, the fact that we would normally have on a given day more than 400 people dying in this country, saying that is it is a very, very small additional death toll, that we are killing the economy, that it is time already to take the foot off some of these measures and free up the economy. Are they underestimating what this virus could do not just to the health of so many Australians but also to our health and hospital systems?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, of course they are, and it's a bit like when people say, well, if you haven't had any boats arrive in Australia, then why do you keep running a border protection regime? And of course, we've had many who have tried, but that's been an effective regime. Equally, you know, we spend billions and have for many, many years when it comes to protecting Australians from terrorists. And we've been able to thwart many terrorist attacks, 16. But, you know, that means you've got to keep your vigilance. This virus has the potential to do great damage to the health of Australians and their wellbeing and not just necessarily those in older age groups. As we've seen overseas, we've seen this move right through the community, and so it's very important that we remain very aware of the potential of where this pandemic can go in Australia and not become complacent because of our relative success. I mean, we don't want to end up like New York or like London or like in Spain or in Italy or any of these places. And the decisions and actions we've taken together as a country and the discipline and patience shown by Australians has meant that we've been able to avoid those horror scenarios which, you know, Australia is not immune to. I mean, we can sometimes have complacency in this country. We're optimistic people and that's great, but we also have to keep our sense of realism about the risk.

KENNY: Yeah, it’s so easy to look at, as you say, the UK or New York City and look at what the alternative is. I think people need to remind themselves of that. Nonetheless, I have been critical, as many have been, of state police forces a bit of overzealous policing of the social distancing rules. That’s not really your bailiwick, they’ll sort that out, but we have seen in Tasmania what can happen if people ignore the rules. The revelations we’ve heard today that medicos were involved in a dinner party that has led to a cluster of infections around the health system in northern Tasmania.

PRIME MINISTER: Well, it's being investigated, as the Premier has said, and it just is a reminder that we can't take these things for granted. I mean, yes, we've had a good couple of weeks, but that does not a virus beat. And that's why we have many more in front of us before we could even possibly contemplate the easing of restrictions. And as you say, the states and territories, they all have different enforcement regimes. They're different in Western Australia and South Australia to what they are in Victoria and New South Wales. But to be fair to Victoria and New South Wales, they have many more cases and a much larger population and a much bigger cultural change in the behaviours that we needed to see take place in those states. Now, I think the last few days over Easter have demonstrated that I think Australians have been getting the message and I thank them genuinely for the way that they are seeking to cooperate proactively with the measures that we've got. I believe that that will mean that that will enable us down the track to have, you know, a different type of regime in terms of how these things are enforced and I have no doubt that the states and territories will be considering that positively. I mean, there's got to be a reward for all of this great effort that's going in, and there will be. But we've got to make sure that's done at the right time.

KENNY: One of the real anomalies seems to be in schools, you and the Chief Medical Officer and the Deputy Chief Medical Officers have been arguing for a long while that the place for children at the moment should be in schools. Yet the larger states are going to an online model in the second term. Do you think that’s wise, you leave it up to them, or would you like to see kids back in schools as soon as possible?

PRIME MINISTER: We've been working to try and get a consistent approach and let's be clear about one thing. The health advice is very clear, and that is the children are not at risk by going to school. And what is at risk is teachers, particularly those in vulnerable groups, cohorts, ages, other vulnerable health issues being in the school environment and that's what needs to be addressed and that's why schools have moved to a mixture of online learning and in-class learning. Now, in places like South Australia, the school attendance rate is much higher than it is in, say, New South Wales and in Victoria, they're going back today on the model that was basically operating just before New South Wales schools went into the term break just last week. What is also important though, Chris, is the education outcomes for our kids. I've said it many times. This virus is going to take a lot of things from us. I do not want it to take a year of a child's education, precious years for these children. And you know, if online and distance learning was a better way of delivering education, then that's what we’d do all the time. We wouldn't have schools, we wouldn't have all of that infrastructure and all of these sorts of things. Of course, teaching in the classroom, teaching face to face, teaching in that environment with kids together is a positive environment for children to learn. And I think, you know, this has got to be a high priority, particularly given the health advice and the risk of children. We've got to get those issues right for the safety of teachers, that's fair enough. But ultimately, we need to get kids back into school and that's increasingly being recognised around the world. The French President has made similar comments today. But the health advice has been very consistent. Getting kids back into school will also free up, I think, more opportunities in our economy to get to more economic activity going. But in order to ease the sort of restrictions we've seen in place now, which have only been, frankly, a couple of weeks. To do that, we need a greater health capacity to be able to respond to these sorts of outbreaks and respond very effectively. We need a greater degree of tracing capability for contacts, and that can happen much more quickly than it does now, and a testing regime that is much more universal so we can get onto the outbreaks very quickly when they respond. Now, we have one of the best testing regimes in the world, but even that is not up to that scale yet, and so there's quite a bit more work to do before we can give ourselves the leave pass to be even contemplating easing those restrictions.

KENNY: When it comes to schools, what’s the problem, though? Is it the teacher’s unions dictating terms to the state government?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, they’re discussions taking place between those unions and teachers themselves and the leadership of schools. It’s happening with independent schools, Catholic schools, as well as public schools. So, you know, it is a live debate. But I want to be clear what it's about and what it's not about. It's not about the health of kids. The medical advice has been completely consistent on that grounds, on that front. When it comes to the health and workplace environment of teachers, well, there are some legitimate issues there,  - that have been raised and which need to be addressed and that's what the medical expert panel has been working with the National Cabinet and myself on and there'll be further discussions about that this week.

KENNY: One group who seems to be very keen to get back to business as usual are the NRL. What hope do you give of the Sharks being out there at the end of next month?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, if they do go back, I hope they score a few more points than they did in the first two rounds. They have put in some good performances, I give them great credit. They were both close games. But look, I like the ambition because I want Australians to have the ambition to get things back to where they were. We all want that. No one wants to keep these sorts of restrictions in place any longer than they have to be. But right now, they are absolutely necessary to protect the health and livelihoods and lives of Australians. And so they will remain in place so long as we believe that is absolutely essential. But it's good to have plans to get the way back to where we want to be. That's what we're working on as a National Cabinet. This Thursday we will be considering further plans about how we can chart that way back to get the economy operating at a much higher level than it is now so it can support people's incomes, which will reduce the need to rely on taxpayers more broadly through the income supports that we've put in place. I mean, that's what we have to achieve. We've bought six months through the JobKeeper program and the JobSeeker program and the many other things we've done with child care and private hospitals and a lot of these changes to actually get this way out charted. This is a temporary set of arrangements where a government is responding in a crisis to an emergency set of conditions and these are the responses that are necessary to keep businesses together. Because we know on the other side, if the businesses can be held together with their employees, then we will be able to respond more quickly on the other side. Growth will take off far quicker than it would otherwise. You won't have people languishing for as long in unemployment or businesses, but, you know, in receivership or being pursued by creditors or by landlords or things like this. Our plan has always been about preserving businesses as the centre of the economy, not the government at the centre of the economy. Businesses are the centre of our economy, and we want to ensure that they get through this intact in as much a form as that we can so they can lead the recovery, the economic recovery on the other side.

KENNY: Just a couple of things very briefly, the Chinese Embassy has hit back at criticism over China’s handling over the coronavirus, claims they were slow to tell the rest of the world what was going on. Is Beijing culpable for what has gone on here?

PRIME MINISTER: I haven’t engaged in a commentary on other country’s policies and how they handle it. This is a wretched problem and one that is really, really pushing all governments to their limits in terms of getting the right answer for their country. In Australia, I've been very focused on getting the right answer for Australia, not looking to carbon copy solutions or policies from other places. We've been getting it right for our country, our economy, our values, how we do things. The virus obviously started up in China and it was transmitted from there. That's just a simple statement of fact, but that is not implying any criticism. It's just a recognition of what has occurred. I mean, one of the very important things we did, as I mentioned earlier in this discussion, was when we're able to lock off that travel from people coming from mainland China early and the work that was done, the patience and the isolation that was put in place by our Chinese-Australian community, which were our most at risk community back in early February, was fantastic. I mean, their actions, their self isolation, their support for each other, Chinese-Australians here in those early weeks of this outbreak has saved Australia from a far worse fate than the one we're experiencing now and I commend them. 

KENNY: And most Australia, I think, have appreciated your leadership and to be fair the leadership of premiers, Labor and Liberal around the country, through your National Cabinet. It works. Getting the leaders together, making quick decisions. Can that stay in place forever, long after the virus has gone?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, look, I mean, its success to date, I think, commends itself. It's not really something we're turning our minds to at the moment. We're too focused on the decisions we've got to make every single week. But I think all of us feel it's been a very effective mechanism. The most effective we've seen the Federation, I think, ever operate as far as I can see, and that's been an important tool for the country to be able to do this. You look back at previous times of crisis, you look back, you know, during the Great Depression and what was happening back then with the Scullin Government and then what was able to be achieved in the Lyons Government. I mean, taking a step back into history, these sorts of things didn't exist. And, you know, we've seen in the past, you go back to the Spanish Flu back in Australia a century ago, it was the breakdown in how the states worked together that made that episode far worse than it otherwise had been. So was it an early lesson for us that we know we needed to ensure the Federation worked as a tight unit together. And I really do thank the other Premiers and Chief Ministers. I mean, everything is just checked at the door. We've all got jobs to do as leaders of governments, and that's to do the right thing by our people, and I hope that's what Australians are seeing. Because that's certainly what we're all doing our best to do. 

KENNY: Just finally, Scott Morrison, you’ve suddenly ended up in a position where moreso, I would suggest, that any Australian outside of wartime. You’ve got enormous pressure on you, dealing with an enormous public health and economic issue. How are you bearing up? Where do you draw strength?

PRIME MINISTER: Thanks for the question, I appreciate your concern. And can I also thank many Australians who have written and emailed and rung in and in and posted on social media asking about us. We're fine, our family is great. I draw great strength from my family and my faith. And for my colleagues, my ministers are doing an outstanding job. They really are. Whether it's Greg Hunt over in Health, who's making sure we're getting that equipment and working so well with the states. Josh Frydenberg leading our economic charge. Dan Tehan and the work he's done in Education and childcare. I'll go get in trouble for not making them all. Karen Andrews doing amazing work, repurposing manufacturing lines to produce PPE equipment. I mean, the team is working together and that's what sustains me. I've got a great team, whether it's the National Cabinet I’m working with or my own team, my own colleagues are out in their electorates supporting them. This is how we get through. It is Team Australia, it's been said, and I draw great strength from that and the Australian people.

KENNY: Prime Minister, thanks so much for joining us.

PRIME MINISTER: Thanks, Chris. 

https://pmtranscripts.pmc.gov.au/release/transcript-42781